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  1. #8851
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoff View Post
    I'm not basing anything on a headline. But unfortunately that's precisely what the people who commissioned this key word search "study" are doing and they've gone further to produce thier new headline "The Debate is over" (www.theconcensusproject.com).

    I think the scientists in the linked article above who have been incorrectly attributed in the "study" paint a pretty clear picture of what is wrong with it. Upon reflection I think you are right that though, likening it to a year 10 standard was a bit harsh.
    You bet it was harsh. What a put down for year 1o students

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    You bet it was harsh. What a put down for year 1o students
    I know, it wouldn't have got through the year 10 peer review.

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    I wonder if this will get a run in the MSM.

    Met Office admits claims of significant temperature rise untenable.

    Read it here. - Bishop Hill blog - Met Office admits claims of significant temperature rise@untenable

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    I wonder if this will get a run in the MSM.

    Met Office admits claims of significant temperature rise untenable.

    Read it here. - Bishop Hill blog - Met Office admits claims of significant temperature rise@untenable
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails met_office_apology_000.gif  

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    Lies, damn lies and statistics, then when it can't get any lower along comes Andrew Montford aka hockey stick man, and we get someone who can roll it all into one package and viola a poo with a pink ribbon around it. I doubt many would be able to follow it and i also doubt Montfords understanding goes much beyond statistics 101 but go ahead and pretend anyway it is not as if anyone cares.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    Lies, damn lies and statistics, then when it can't get any lower along comes Andrew Montford aka hockey stick man, and we get someone who can roll it all into one package and viola a poo with a pink ribbon around it. I doubt many would be able to follow it and i also doubt Montfords understanding goes much beyond statistics 101 but go ahead and pretend anyway it is not as if anyone cares.
    Cares about what?

    Also where does Montford come into it?

    Did you even read what this was about?

    If you did you might also realise the significance of it. The problem is too many people are just prepared to bury their head in the sand and rubbish anything that doesn't fit their theory.

    Read it and you will see what lengths they went too, so not to answer a basic question.

    Don't worry regardless of what you think this will have an effect and so it should.

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    Montford is Bishop Hill, the statistical variables are playing with numbers, it is not an easy read and really doesn't add anything it is more a smoke screen relying on variables to obscure the reality of temperature increase including water temperature. The play on the met office reply is a poor one, little more than petty point scoring, these little exchanges are no more than worthless comentary, I doubt the MSM will pick it up because it is childish and not particularly digestible to the public at large.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    Montford is Bishop Hill, the statistical variables are playing with numbers, it is not an easy read and really doesn't add anything it is more a smoke screen relying on variables to obscure the reality of temperature increase including water temperature. The play on the met office reply is a poor one, little more than petty point scoring, these little exchanges are no more than worthless comentary, I doubt the MSM will pick it up because it is childish and not particularly digestible to the public at large.
    I guess this is your opinion.

    However Montford is only the messenger. I guess its OK to attempt to discredit the issue by shooting the messenger. If this is not a big deal why did they refuse to answer? The reason is that the correct answer would discredit the AGW Theory, which it has. You ignore the fact that the temperature increase is not statistically significant outside normal variation. That is what this means, regardless of the warmists slant.

    It is just another nail in the AGW coffin. Unless warming ramps up very soon it will be the final one.

  9. #8859
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    Lysenkoism and Global Warming Theory

    Posted on April 28, 2013 by Anthony Watts
    From Forbes: The Disgraceful Episode Of Lysenkoism Brings Us Global Warming Theory
    Trofim Lysenko became the Director of the Soviet Lenin All-Union Academy of Agricultural Sciences in the 1930s under Josef Stalin. He was an advocate of the theory that characteristics acquired by plants during their lives could be inherited by later generations stemming from the changed plants, which sharply contradicted Mendelian genetics. As a result, Lysenko became a fierce critic of theories of the then rising modern genetics.

    This same practice of Lysenkoism has long been under way in western science in regard to the politically correct theory of man caused, catastrophic, global warming. That theory serves the political fashions of the day in promoting vastly increased government powers and control over the private economy. Advocates of the theory are lionized in the dominant Democrat party controlled media in the U.S., and in leftist controlled media in other countries. Critics of the theory are denounced as “deniers,” and even still bourgeois fascists, with their motives impugned.
    Those who promote the theory are favored with billions from government grants and neo-Marxist environmentalist largesse, and official recognition and award. Faked and tampered data and evidence has arisen in favor of the politically correct theory. Is not man-caused, catastrophic global warming now the only theory allowed to be taught in schools in the West?
    Those in positions of scientific authority in the West who have collaborated with this new Lysenkoism because they felt they must be politically correct, and/or because of the money, publicity, and recognition to be gained, have disgraced themselves and the integrity of their institutions, organizations and publications.
    Read the entire essay here: The Disgraceful Episode Of Lysenkoism Brings Us Global Warming Theory - Forbes


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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    I guess this is your opinion.

    However Montford is only the messenger. I guess its OK to attempt to discredit the issue by shooting the messenger. If this is not a big deal why did they refuse to answer? The reason is that the correct answer would discredit the AGW Theory, which it has. You ignore the fact that the temperature increase is not statistically significant outside normal variation. That is what this means, regardless of the warmists slant.

    It is just another nail in the AGW coffin. Unless warming ramps up very soon it will be the final one.
    This isn't all that different to an earlier post supporting the view that 96% or whatever of climate scientists support the view of a warming planet. the article wasn't wrong in its figures it simply used those that stated an opinion and ignored those that didn't. It was misleading in that the conculsion while indicitative went a bit far in the final conclusion.

    This statistical analysis is much the same it has set up a frame work that gets a certain result, however the coclusion is a step to far and one we should be skeptical about. It is important we don't allow our bias to over ride what we read and see a conclusion that is greater than the quality of the evidence.

  11. #8861
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Lysenkoism and Global Warming Theory

    Posted on April 28, 2013 by Anthony Watts
    From Forbes: The Disgraceful Episode Of Lysenkoism Brings Us Global Warming Theory
    Trofim Lysenko became the Director of the Soviet Lenin All-Union Academy of Agricultural Sciences in the 1930s under Josef Stalin. He was an advocate of the theory that characteristics acquired by plants during their lives could be inherited by later generations stemming from the changed plants, which sharply contradicted Mendelian genetics. As a result, Lysenko became a fierce critic of theories of the then rising modern genetics.

    This same practice of Lysenkoism has long been under way in western science in regard to the politically correct theory of man caused, catastrophic, global warming. That theory serves the political fashions of the day in promoting vastly increased government powers and control over the private economy. Advocates of the theory are lionized in the dominant Democrat party controlled media in the U.S., and in leftist controlled media in other countries. Critics of the theory are denounced as “deniers,” and even still bourgeois fascists, with their motives impugned.
    Those who promote the theory are favored with billions from government grants and neo-Marxist environmentalist largesse, and official recognition and award. Faked and tampered data and evidence has arisen in favor of the politically correct theory. Is not man-caused, catastrophic global warming now the only theory allowed to be taught in schools in the West?
    Those in positions of scientific authority in the West who have collaborated with this new Lysenkoism because they felt they must be politically correct, and/or because of the money, publicity, and recognition to be gained, have disgraced themselves and the integrity of their institutions, organizations and publications.
    Read the entire essay here: The Disgraceful Episode Of Lysenkoism Brings Us Global Warming Theory - Forbes

    This is tragic, the fact we even humour the drongos that write this drivel reflects badly on all of us and humankind in general.

  12. #8862
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    This isn't all that different to an earlier post supporting the view that 96% or whatever of climate scientists support the view of a warming planet. the article wasn't wrong in its figures it simply used those that stated an opinion and ignored those that didn't. It was misleading in that the conculsion while indicitative went a bit far in the final conclusion.

    This statistical analysis is much the same it has set up a frame work that gets a certain result, however the coclusion is a step to far and one we should be skeptical about. It is important we don't allow our bias to over ride what we read and see a conclusion that is greater than the quality of the evidence.
    John you can ignore the real meaning of this by glossing it over as much as you want. The fact remains that this is turning sentiment against AGW where it counts, all those in the middle ground that only believe what they hear and don not research the fact for themselves.

    People are not seeing or feeling the warming that was predicted. They are realising that the models are not even close in their predictions, so guess what? They too start to question AGW.

    Without the support of empirical evidence to support the theory, it is going to go belly up no matter what. We are in the middle of that process now. Every where you look you can see evidence of people backing away from the extremism. Only those really rusted on folks are gonna hold on to this baby for as long as they can.

    Cheers Rod

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    John you can ignore the real meaning of this by glossing it over as much as you want. The fact remains that this is turning sentiment against AGW where it counts, all those in the middle ground that only believe what they hear and don not research the fact for themselves.

    People are not seeing or feeling the warming that was predicted. They are realising that the models are not even close in their predictions, so guess what? They too start to question AGW.

    Without the support of empirical evidence to support the theory, it is going to go belly up no matter what. We are in the middle of that process now. Every where you look you can see evidence of people backing away from the extremism. Only those really rusted on folks are gonna hold on to this baby for as long as they can.

    Cheers Rod
    You can turn all the sentiment you want but that won't change the fact that the change is still happening. Regardless of whether you accept the reason for it or not...it is still happening.

    And there is very little going on in the socio-political arena in the way of a response, either in terms of mitigation or adaptation.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    People are not seeing or feeling the warming that was predicted. They are realising that the models are not even close in their predictions, so guess what? They too start to question AGW.
    Talked to a boffin from BoM yesterday who made the observation that all the climate models used in Oz over the last twenty years have been pointing the same way as the observed trend in temperature - warmer. Sure there's a relatively low level of precision if you are foolish enough to focus on the numbers but they have all nailed the direction and relative strength of the trend.

    The only significant wrinkle in the current models analysis (due for release next year) is the level of forcing going forward - the four scenarios I saw were lower GHG concentrations, small increase, predicted increase and worst case increases. In really simplistic terms (as I understood them) no scenario suggests that cooler average temps will happen anytime soon and all but the first suggest a continuing seasonal shift in rainfall in SE and SW Oz.

    Question AGW all you like (I urge you to continue to do so) but don't do yourself the intellectual disservice of telling yourself that nothing is happening. For example, only half of the farmers I know accept the basic tenets of AGW but they all accept that the climate is changing and it is a greater challenge for them to respond and adapt to on a seasonal basis...

    Don't kid yourself down there...wrapped in your comfortable and insular suburban blanket.
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

  14. #8864
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    Read it and you will see what lengths they went too, so not to answer a basic question.

    Don't worry regardless of what you think this will have an effect and so it should.
    If you read the hansard the actual record of what was said you will see that they did answer it. They offered to meet with Lord Donoughue to explain the process to him. Lords Hansard text for 13 Feb 201313 Feb 2013 (pt 0001)

    Like here in Oz their question time has time restrictions on both question and answer. To expect one politician to explain a complex statistical process to another politician in a few minutes is a bit unreal in my view.

    They also offered to meet with the author of the article Doug Keenan to explain what they did and why. He also declined to take up the offer. Why? The title of Doug's article at Bishop Hill is 'Met office admits claim of significant temperature rise untenable" Can you actually find a quote from the person at the Met office that actually states that? Doug seems to have left that out for some reason.

    The real issue behind the article is that Keenan has a problem with the particular statistical model that the Met office uses. he has a model of his own he would rather use. We should get Doc to share his views on models with him. The issue is not new, Doug first wrote about it over two years ago; remember the big fuss it caused back then? No, me neither. It was regarded as insignificant then too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    You can turn all the sentiment you want but that won't change the fact that the change is still happening. Regardless of whether you accept the reason for it or not...it is still happening.

    And there is very little going on in the socio-political arena in the way of a response, either in terms of mitigation or adaptation.




    Talked to a boffin from BoM yesterday who made the observation that all the climate models used in Oz over the last twenty years have been pointing the same way as the observed trend in temperature - warmer. Sure there's a relatively low level of precision if you are foolish enough to focus on the numbers but they have all nailed the direction and relative strength of the trend.

    The only significant wrinkle in the current models analysis (due for release next year) is the level of forcing going forward - the four scenarios I saw were lower GHG concentrations, small increase, predicted increase and worst case increases. In really simplistic terms (as I understood them) no scenario suggests that cooler average temps will happen anytime soon and all but the first suggest a continuing seasonal shift in rainfall in SE and SW Oz.

    Question AGW all you like (I urge you to continue to do so) but don't do yourself the intellectual disservice of telling yourself that nothing is happening. For example, only half of the farmers I know accept the basic tenets of AGW but they all accept that the climate is changing and it is a greater challenge for them to respond and adapt to on a seasonal basis...

    Don't kid yourself down there...wrapped in your comfortable and insular suburban blanket.
    Never have I said nothing is changing. I accept that the climate is ALWAYS changing and ALWAYS will.

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    All this jibber jabber is all academic any how, because labor is a doubly shot duck & its world leading carbon tax is going to flushed down the gurgler along with the party that have the economic credentials of a blind mullet. If tony gets in he will spend billions of $ trawling through the accounts trying to nail the shysters from all the mad schemes that threw away our dollars while returning a few million to the coffers, what a lovely waste of time & money to look forward to.Regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    Never have I said nothing is changing. I accept that the climate is ALWAYS changing and ALWAYS will.

    Ah yes. But how many of the puny humans are prepared to change & adapt along with it? The evidence to date suggests that not many really are. Good luck with that.
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    All this jibber jabber is all academic any how, because labor is a doubly shot duck & its world leading carbon tax is going to flushed down the gurgler along with the party that have the economic credentials of a blind mullet. If tony gets in he will spend billions of $ trawling through the accounts trying to nail the shysters from all the mad schemes that threw away our dollars while returning a few million to the coffers, what a lovely waste of time & money to look forward to.Regards inter
    Don't you think it would be ironic if Tony was stupid enough to spend billions of $ trawling through accounts, he'd have to be worse than hopeless to have to do that surely. Anyway if you want waste wait until the direct action schemes kick off, pollies don't have a good record of picking winners.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    Ah yes. But how many of the puny humans are prepared to change & adapt along with it? The evidence to date suggests that not many really are. Good luck with that.
    I would say change and adapt is a far greater method of dealing with climate changes, rather than thinking we can somehow dial in the climate we want.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    Don't you think it would be ironic if Tony was stupid enough to spend billions of $ trawling through accounts, he'd have to be worse than hopeless to have to do that surely. Anyway if you want waste wait until the direct action schemes kick off, pollies don't have a good record of picking winners.
    Thats what the liberals did when they took over office in NSW, they called me up one day checking on a solar system I had installed & claimed a rebate for it, they had my mistaken property on a satellite image without a solar system & were asking questions, soon after September I expect another call because the other rebate was a Federal govt one, just remember the libs love to spend a hundred to save ten, the trouble is they have so much scope to work with after this fiasco.
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Thats what the liberals did when they took over office in NSW, they called me up one day checking on a solar system I had installed & claimed a rebate for it, they had my mistaken property on a satellite image without a solar system & were asking questions, soon after September I expect another call because the other rebate was a Federal govt one, just remember the libs love to spend a hundred to save ten, the trouble is they have so much scope to work with after this fiasco.
    regards inter

    Labor did the same with it's own pink bat scheme and clawed back a lot of money from shonky operators. All government programs have some form of auditing procedure some more stringent than others where ever there is a bucket of money you will find a crook trying to dip a bit for themselves. Despite the media hype or lack of it i don't think there will be much more to find under Labor than under an LNP government. Finally we are getting some fiscal comment in the press showing the economy was in structural deficit when Labor took over (no surprise the information was there five years ago), it doesn't excuse Swan as he failed to do anything about it. Neither of those men had a strong financial background and you would hope Hockey may with his background rise to the occassion and we might finally have a treasurer that understands numbers beyond the level of a kindergarten treasurer. Current political comment is dreadful at the moment, neither side are seen in the correct light by the public and both a lazy press and a dumb public have a lot to answer for. It is so poisonous that the big fear for Abbot is that if he fails to deliver to expectations the press and public may well turn on him as they turned on Gillard and unfortunately that damages both public confidence and the economy. What most people fail to accept is all our political parties are conservative, all are a mix of talent and stupidity, there will no sudden change with a new government other than a surge in confidence and that will quickly evaporate if the LNP doesn't meet the expectations it has created.

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    Yes they all audit in some way, the ultra conservative types go through with a fine toothed comb, whereas the others use a yard broom & conveniently sweep all the problems seemingly away, so we actually have to pay for 2 audits. Any sane business person would write it off.
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Yes they all audit in some way, the ultra conservative types go through with a fine toothed comb, whereas the others use a yard broom & conveniently sweep all the problems seemingly away, so we actually have to pay for 2 audits. Any sane business person would write it off.
    regards inter
    I've dealt with these things (grant audits) over many years, to be honest their isn't much difference regardless of which brand of clowns have the reins. Sometimes the public announcements are different but the paperwork and scrutiny never seems to alter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    I've dealt with these things (grant audits) over many years, to be honest their isn't much difference regardless of which brand of clowns have the reins. Sometimes the public announcements are different but the paperwork and scrutiny never seems to alter.
    you have to be joking of course, nobody is talking about grants here. if you have you any experience being involved in the federal Govt treasury, Departments or Divisions you would know what I was on about because I was employed by many of them over 10 years & saw the stupidness that came through with a change of Gov't. The first stupid thing to happen is a Department Name change, that alone can run into tens of millions of $
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    you have to be joking of course, nobody is talking about grants here. if you have you any experience being involved in the federal Govt treasury, Departments or Divisions you would know what I was on about because I was employed by many of them over 10 years & saw the stupidness that came through with a change of Gov't. The first stupid thing to happen is a Department Name change, that alone can run into tens of millions of $
    regards inter
    Which side has the monopoly on that, we excel at that little game in Victoria, you are talking about waste there is no need to get nasty. The pink batts is one of the topical subjects that gets aired when the word waste comes up, what is that if it is not a grant allocation. Waste is at all levels some of it also comes when they make a dogs breakfast of legislation, there has been some shockers over the years that have been designed by politicians and ended up being expensive and not that workable in operation. Sometimes the public gets all caught up in their favourite political brand and becomes totally blind to the dumb on "their" side and the "good" of the other side. I believe the rusted on political fan is a blight on society and a barrier to economic growth irrespective of the side they sit on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    I would say change and adapt is a far greater method of dealing with climate changes, rather than thinking we can somehow dial in the climate we want.
    Absolutely. But I don't think anyone (regardless of which end of the debate one is on) is suggesting that we can somehow dial in the climate we want.

    If they are...more fool them. If anyone thinks they are...fools twice over.
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    just remember the libs love to spend a hundred to save ten, the trouble is they have so much scope to work with after this fiasco.

    true in every way. Though I suspect your money is pretty safe this time since there aren't enough (and won't be) public servants left to engage the necessary contractors to do the various audits to even start the clawback let alone to do the job themselves...
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    true in every way. Though I suspect your money is pretty safe this time since there aren't enough (and won't be) public servants left to engage the necessary contractors to do the various audits to even start the clawback let alone to do the job themselves...
    Well the first reshuffle will be moving all the bureaucrats who were spending all the money without a care in the world, to another department where they will be examining in ever so fine detail where that all that money went. Some will go at the bottom of the food chain, but the real dead wood will remain further up.
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Freud View Post
    Fool me once....ok, never mind Dubya's quote.





    Our great friend Mr Andrew Bolt reads the tea leaves here:



    Well worth a read if you want to know why this cult is rapidly unravelling. (Apologies, no video this time, but I am happy to post a picture for each of the 10 signs if there is any confusion?)
    It's a safe bet to assume that a fair bit of what Doc posts is complete bulls**t and this post is another good example. Not that it's his fault, he just cuts and pastes without checking because he is a true believer. The Time magazine cover on the left is a fake photoshopped from another edition with the wording and date altered. here is the real one.


    The 1970s Ice Age Myth and Time Magazine Covers – by David Kirtley – Greg Laden's Blog

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    This is tragic, the fact we even humour the drongos that write this drivel reflects badly on all of us and humankind in general.
    Tragic indeed that such pathetic pseudo religion has even seen the light of day.
    As for Lysenkoism, it is a fair and accurate description of the kind of manure supported by mercenary scientist defending their pay.
    "...lysenkoism used to describe the manipulation or distortion of the scientific process as a way to reach a predetermined conclusion as dictated by an ideological bias,often related to social or political objective. " from Wiki...
    One could not find a more accurate description of the AGW hypothesis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    One could not find a more accurate description of the AGW hypothesis.
    ...or your virulent reaction against it.

    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

  32. #8882
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    Default How depressing

    I was listening to what seemed like a very intelligent woman on the ABC tonight talking about the dna of old killer diseases like black plague, leprosy etc. I was very interested and though what a smart woman until this.

    She claims that the little ice age was caused by the death of 40% of humans in Europe, due to the lack of firewood being burnt. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    How can a very intelligent woman come up with this stuff.

    Surely not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    I was listening to what seemed like a very intelligent woman on the ABC tonight talking about the dna of old killer diseases like black plague, leprosy etc. I was very interested and though what a smart woman until this.

    She claims that the little ice age was caused by the death of 40% of humans in Europe, due to the lack of firewood being burnt. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    How can a very intelligent woman come up with this stuff.

    Surely not.
    Diseases have dna? Seems wrong to me. And leprosy is still with us though not necessarily a killer any more. Sounds like no real understanding of science at all.
    Maybe it was Cori Bernardi in drag.

    Got a link? I'd like to have a listen before jumping to conclusions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilT2 View Post
    Diseases have dna? Seems wrong to me. And leprosy is still with us though not necessarily a killer any more. Sounds like no real understanding of science at all.
    Maybe it was Cori Bernardi in drag.

    Got a link? I'd like to have a listen before jumping to conclusions.
    Old DNA containing the virus My bad wording.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    I was listening to what seemed like a very intelligent woman on the ABC tonight talking about the dna of old killer diseases like black plague, leprosy etc. I was very interested and though what a smart woman until this.

    She claims that the little ice age was caused by the death of 40% of humans in Europe, due to the lack of firewood being burnt. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    How can a very intelligent woman come up with this stuff.

    Surely not.
    Just because a woman doesn't agree with your own pet notions doesn't mean she is not intelligent and instantly worthy of condemnation. Besides this was only an aside, right or wrong it shouldn't detract from whatever her main subject was. BBC NEWS | Science/Nature | Europe's chill linked to disease this seems to be on that track, hardly enough there for anyone to get all indignant over is it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    ....She claims that the little ice age was caused by the death of 40% of humans in Europe, due to the lack of firewood being burnt. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    How can a very intelligent woman come up with this stuff.

    Surely not.
    It's really easy. Happens to every expert in their chosen field when they step outside that chosen field using only their knowledge and experience within that field and their self righteous belief that they have all the answers. Don't have to be a scientist either...could be a builder, bus driver, politician, wildlife carer etc etc etc

    A range of things contributed to the 'Little Ice Age'. Her conjecture merely adds to that list...
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

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    She claims that the little ice age was caused by the death of 40% of humans in Europe, due to the lack of firewood being burnt. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    It depends on whether she was discussing her own ideas or quoting a paper she had read. It does sound a bit like the work of Tom van Hoof but I can't find anything that he has published recently. One of his papers from 2006 discusses the impact of the black plague in Europe and how abandoned farmland was reclaimed by forest and this resulted in a reduction in CO2 of around 30ppm and this caused the ice age. Nothing about firewood though. If van Hoof is right about this then the climate is incredibly sensitive to small changes in CO2 levels.

    Her remarks about leprosy come from a recent edition of Science magazine.

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    you couldn't make up the stuff which is going on in the ruling party at the moment, it will give the comedians subject matter for years.
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilT2 View Post
    She claims that the little ice age was caused by the death of 40% of humans in Europe, due to the lack of firewood being burnt. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    It depends on whether she was discussing her own ideas or quoting a paper she had read. It does sound a bit like the work of Tom van Hoof but I can't find anything that he has published recently. One of his papers from 2006 discusses the impact of the black plague in Europe and how abandoned farmland was reclaimed by forest and this resulted in a reduction in CO2 of around 30ppm and this caused the ice age. Nothing about firewood though. If van Hoof is right about this then the climate is incredibly sensitive to small changes in CO2 levels.

    Her remarks about leprosy come from a recent edition of Science magazine.

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    Meanwhile, in other news:



    And one Anthony Watts conveniently 'forgets' that to compare different temperature data sets they need to be corrected for their baselines, yet Again. He's been doing this since 2008, each time 'discovering' his mistake yet not learning from it. If you correct for baselines his post is reduced to rubbish. If, like Anthony you wonder (again) what the baseline fuss is about, there is a good explanation and example at the open data repository and graphing site WoodForTrees

    And Obama is getting tired of battling the flat earth society in Congress: Barack Obama lays out new US plan to fight climate change - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

    woodbe.

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    Happy days. Go GILLARD I hope she wins!!!

    With a bit of luck we will lose both Gillard and Rudd

    Rudd will have to resign and BETTER YET we get to kick Gillard out at the election.

    What could be better than that!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    Happy days. Go GILLARD I hope she wins!!!

    With a bit of luck we will lose both Gillard and Rudd

    Rudd will have to resign and BETTER YET we get to kick Gillard out at the election.

    What could be better than that!!!
    Bad luck, she lost!

    Stick to your day job

    woodbe.

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    Extreme temperatures including highest levels of hot air and CO2 in the ACT last night, weather warning - expect more of the same in the next 80 days.
    P.s didn't someone write a book about round the world in 80 days, big Kev could do it twice in the 747 Kev !
    cheers Look out if I have a tape measure in my hand.....I'm upto something

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    Bit of hot air and hot heads at Suncorp last night as NSW went down in a big way at the state of origin game. Was there something else happening as well?

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilT2 View Post
    Was there something else happening as well?
    Yeah! A repeat of 'American Pickers' on the 7Mate digital channel. And some sketch comedy show on the ABC that didn't make much sense to me...
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

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    Default How to Vote

    Doesn't have the aspiring new candidates in it, but here you go:



    Our sitting member is Liberal and accepts the science. That is one of his few endearing features It would appear that's Rod's rep is ALP and there is insufficient data regarding his stance in the science.

    From Election 2013 Reps | uknowispeaksense

    There is also a Senate version.

    woodbe.

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    As politicians...what they actually believe and what they are prepared to do to act on those beliefs are two entirely different things. With all due respect, that makes this list almost entirely useless.

    I think I'm going to vote for Glenn Lazarus and his mate, Clive Palmer. The Brick With Eyes has such awesome presence in that mob's television advertising
    People don't ever seem to realise that doing what's right is no guarantee against misfortune

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    The coalition used to have a policy of soil carbon storage which involved paying farmers to change the way they grew crops so as to increase the amount of carbon stored in the soil. The Nationals supported this policy, although they deny climate change exists, as it meant farmers got paid to do this. However they disputed the amount the Liberals were willing to pay. They believed farmers should be paid a great deal more of the taxpayers money for solving a problem that they don't believe exists. Nothing like standing up for your principles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilT2 View Post
    The coalition used to have a policy of soil carbon storage which involved paying farmers to change the way they grew crops so as to increase the amount of carbon stored in the soil. The Nationals supported this policy, although they deny climate change exists, as it meant farmers got paid to do this. However they disputed the amount the Liberals were willing to pay. They believed farmers should be paid a great deal more of the taxpayers money for solving a problem that they don't believe exists. Nothing like standing up for your principles.
    Do you have anything to back up your claim that they don't believe climate change exists?

    its just that their website lists it as one of their policy priorities.

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    If you go to the original site that has the list of where each politician stands you will find the author explains his methodology and gives some extracts from speeches they made that justifies his conclusions. If you don't accept his evidence then a quick google may help. I believe he also contacted the office of many of the politicians to attempt to clarify their exact position on the issue. But getting a straight answer was challenging. That's a surprise!

    I tend to go more by their actions than their words. When a politician is seen uncritically promoting Monckton's ideas, Ian Plimer's books or Bolt's blog then I take that as a strong indication that they don't accept the science behind climate change. In the upcoming election campaign look to see some of these people backing away from their prior support for Monckton and others if they haven't already.


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