Hello all. I am ashamed to say that despite assiduous planning, I laid the shower tiles only to find that at the highest point, approx 1000mm away from waste, the level of the tiles is above that of the angle. The rest falls nicely to the waste, but I am assuming that water will not be contained within the shower if there is not an approximately 5mm lip on the angle, above the level of the tiles.

The way I see it my options are as follows:
1. Insert flat bar inside current angle to raise height and waterproof accordingly (waterproofing is both below and above screed).

3. Insert some sort of lip at the edge of the tiles.

2. Remove screed and start again.

Any thoughts from my learned colleagues.

Gordon

Hey Gordon, Im actually not sure what you mean, got any photos??

..I think he may be referring to the water stop aluminium angle used around the shower...and the fact it is not protruding above tile height....

As mentioned a photo is worth a thousand words - and also is it an open shower, enclosed etc etc.

Cheers

Hey guys

It is exactly as AN_3 suggests and was somewhat frustrating. The tiles protruded above the level of the angle, at the top end (left hand end) of the shower enclosure. The fall in the shower (about 10mm/M) meant that at the level of the waste, the tiles were below the level of the angle so no issue there.

I would have had a photo of the tiles protruding except that now I have used a 40 mm flat bar (well, cut from another length of angle) and Fulaprened it onto the existing angle so that now it is about 5mm above the height of the tiles and is very solid. There is a decent fall in the shower and the shower has a ceiling rose, so it may not be a problem. I enclose a photo of the shower so that you can see the layout. Note that the bottom row of tiles is yet to be put on and I have just grouted (today) the floor. Yes, there is a window in the shower, but that couldn't be helped!

I will be inserting a floor to ceiling toughened glass screen on the right hand side and a 600 mm door, but was fretting somewhat. As suggested, the shower is waterproofed above and below the screed, so the worst that will happen is that some water may get out, but hopefully not much.

Interested in any comments.

Gordon

Attached Thumbnails

 

Thanks for the pic... Nice job so far, except from what I can gather you have the floor levels and aluminium angle setup wrong. Does this mean you have to step OVER the angle, as opposed to step DOWN it from the bathroom into the shower? The bathroom floor tiles should butt up against the aluminium strip, leaving about a 20mm drop into the shower.
Anyway, its all locked in place now and your solution will work as you have adequate fall, plenty of waterproofing, a water stop edge, (and a ceiling rose ) so if your happy with the way it looks then thats all that matters.

...my understanding is the aluminium strip (water stop) is to be finished flush with the finished floor level (AS3740 5.11.9) for an unenclosed shower or finished 10mm above finished floor level for a framed shower screen (MBA Guide to Waterproofing) and is recessed into shower screen frame.

I think what Brettus is referring to is actually called a "step down" shower (the finished floor level of the shower stepped down a minimum of 25mm from outside the shower) and still requires the aluminium angle strip mounted onto the outside floor perimeter surrounding the step down area (water stop) as mentioned, however in this situation the Master Builders Guide to Waterproofing diagrams indicate that it is acceptable practice to conceal the aluminium under a facing of tiles (the waterproofing membrane covers the shower pan, up and over the aluminium angle and then onto the bathroom floor).

On a side note:

When we bought our house - it had a renovated bathroom recently installed. Looked great with large floor tiles on the floor and walls. Great finish - especially using large tiles. Very poorly done technically. It appears for the "trades person" to do their job - they have simply leveled the floor perfectly for the large tiles and run that all the way through the bathroom and shower area. So - when you have a shower - the water is simply contained by the shower screen bottom rail at the door (semi frameless). The kids love it - as they get to play in a puddle..... The bathroom floor needs a squeegee to remove ponded water. I have checked it with a laser leveller and my spirit levels - perfectly flat.

Just another job to add to the list - do another bathroom (at least a new complete floor). "Thank you trades person who obviously has a mantra of time is money over a quality and correctly completed job". Why is it so hard to find "old school" builders and tradespersons who "do it properly - do it once"? Here I am sounding old and i haven't even hit 40 yet.....

Gordon, I would be interested to see a side on shot of what you have done. Im sure its fine, maybe just not done specifically to the code.

An3Bolt, Do you have any diagrams or pics of the set-up you mention where the aluminium strip is 10mm above the floor level for a framed shower screen set-up?
I cant imagine anyone would want a strip protuding above the floor level in any circumstance.

We are doing another bathroom soon and the idea we want to achieve is what we are calling a "step - down" shower base and with a frameless shower screen. I will show you guys a close up photo of what I am talking about on Friday as I know a place that has this exact arrangement.
Cheers

With a framed shower screen - you will not see the exposed water stop strip - because it is concealed beneath the shower screen aluminium frame.

Unenclosed shower area is different, obviously due to the different demands for waterproofing.

The AS3740 is copyrighted - so you will need to refer to the standard for their diagrams (hint visit the library)

Unsure if I am able to scan and post the MBA Waterproofing diagrams for fear of infringing copyright.

With regards to the water stops - the way I read AS3740 with regards to the requirement of water stops, particularly when reading 5.11.9, if you waterproof the entire area, the only water stop required is one at the doorway and to be flush with the finished surface.

The bottom line for me: AS3740 is the MINIMUM requirement for waterproofing. I much preferred the MBA Guide to Waterproofing, as it goes beyond the minimum to create a practical guide. But why not use some common sense - for the sake of lets say an extra $100 of material for a liquid applied membrane, why not waterproof the entire bathroom floor as well as the minimum required areas?

I had a shower done where the tiler laid the screed to the height of the aluminium angle, and then tiled on top of this.

I can confirm that this approach categorically does not work, as was evidenced by tiles on the rest of the floor lifting up with water damage underneath, about two years later.

The top of the strip should be flush with the top of the tiles as a minimum, otherwise water will soak onto the rest of the floor - the screed bed and the tile glue/grout acts as a water reservoir which will happily keep wetting the rest of the floor for you.

__________________
Electrical info on domestic wiring and appliance repair to AS/NZS3000. Only for New Zealanders, as Australians aren't smart enough to do their own!

OK I have attached a pic of the "step down" setup which I am referring to, I thought this is what Gordon was referring to.
My other bathroom has the floor and the shower base on the same level except that the shower base is screeded towards the waste....... I didnt see any water stop angle installed with this..

I cannot think of any other way you would do this, so I would love to see pics of the what you have doen Gordon and what you are referring to An3bolt.
Cheers

Attached Thumbnails

 

I am about to tile my bathroom and have been wondering how to overcome the fall problem between shower waste and main floor waste - small bathroom, no hob and using 300x300 tiles. After looking at several new unit developments locally (purely for the bathrooms ) I have found the step down with the aluminium angle common. On one bathroom the frameless screen/no door was positioned inside the lip sitting on the shower tiles (as per above photo), all others (with or without door) are positioned on the top ledge - main floor tiles. This looks the cleanest and neatest finish. None used a channel though as was used in above photo, just siliconed. I will probably use a semi frameless screen so the glass will unfortunately not be in line with the step due to the frame.