Thread: Frog Pond

Hi folks

I'm considering installing a small pond in the front yard, both for appearance and to provide some extra habitat for the local frog population. However, I'm not sure whether there are any rules about putting such things in an unfenced front yard (in suburban Sydney), mostly from a child safety perspective of course. Does anyone know the answer? The local Council planning advisors won't be answering calls for at least another week, I suspect!

Put some heavy gal weld mesh (50 *50) just (50 to 75mm) below the surface to stop kids and birds.
Make the bottom of the pond slope from 300mm to 600mm deep.

I can't help you with regulations, but I'd imagine that if it's pretty shallow, there'd be almost no chance of anyone drowning in it.
I'm also building a fish pond/water feature/ waterfall/ creek, type arrangement in my backyard shortly. I'll be using a couple of layers of rubber type membrane , siliconed and fixed along two edges to a retaining wall I built. I'll have to put some weld mesh in as DavidG has suggested, because I've got a couple of dogs in my yard and I can't have them eating my fish or puncturing my membranes.

If anyone has any tips on pond construction I'd be interested.

(Sorry to hijack your thread without adding any useful information Tony.)

Regs vary from council to council but at the end of the day sadly when you come to kids you don't need much depth to drown. The gal mesh is the best idea. Make sure though you use some rubber hose to cover the ends of the cut mesh so it won't cut into your lining. Also I would recommend an external pump setup so you arn't always lifting the mesh to carry out maintenance. Try to lay the lining on top of a layer of beach sand or some other soft membrane (carpet underlay?) to stop the lining from tearing. Also consider where you position the pond in relation to the amount of sun it gets and the amount of falling leaves from trees, etc. Full sun is great for flowering plants (I think some lillies need 5 hours of full sun to flower) but it also encourages algae build up. I have mine in an area that gets about 3 hours of sun a day so the need for algae suppresent is minimal.
I hope you love frogs. I have some living in my garden storm water drainage pits and they drive me crazy when they start to croak. They can be noisy buggers when they want to be.

Thanks guys

The weldmesh is a good idea. I'm just going to use one of the ready-bought moulded HDPE liners that landscaping shops sell, sort of kidney shaped with a shallow bit at each end, about 2m by 1 metre, expensive I know but quick and easy! The water will end up about 40 cm deep at the deepest point.

Happy New Year to all!

Tony

Considering frogs are very sensitive, would the mesh rust or leach anything that could be absorbed into the frogs skin?

I know if they are not happy with their pond they will just up and go..

What about instead of the mesh you add rocks at certain depths to limit it.

I think the child safe depth is 30cm.

Yes galvernised steel will leach Zinc which is toxic to both plants and animals. Frogs don't need much depth, about 200mm will do but macrophytic plants need about 300mm min. If you get plants growing you dont need a pump and filter as the plants provide O2 and keep the water clear.
Use lots of rocks around the edge to provide shelter and site the pond in a shady area with as little direct sunlight as possible.
A real bugger with them is frogs don't like chlorine so you cant have a float valve - auto top up water setup, you have to top up with a bucket and add chlorine neutralizer drops.
I've just got a new batch of stripped marsh frogs out of my pond - very rewarding.

Thanks Bleedin for that info.

Tony go the plants and rocks. You are not only limiting the depth of water you are also creating protection for the taddies and ledges for the frogs to rest on.

Plus it will look better (more natural) then mesh..

We have striped marsh frogs, and have had for many years

we ONLY use tank water for them, they are very appreciative!

Do you know what frogs are around, and that you want to encourage?

If you keep frogs captive you need a permit but not for what you are doing.

Do you know about the frog and tadpole society?

http://www.fats.org.au/

Good information Bleedin Thumb. I wouldn't have thought of the Zinc leaching, or the chlorine problem. I don't suppose plain steel mesh rusting would do any harm? Iron is supposed to be a vitamin.

My sister has a fantastic looking fish pond that she's just finished, but it has a few problems. She's losing a bit of water and she's not sure where. It could be a puncture in the membrane, and apparently there's some sort of clay product that you can put in the water that helps seal leaks. I think they use it in dams on farms, but I don't know if it would affect the fish. It also could be leaching out through the beach that she's made. The sand carries up right over the membrane, and capillary action could be drawing the water up over the edge.

There's also another problem with her set up. She has a tiled patio, laid on a slight fall, and there's a narrow moat that goes around three sides and leads into the pond. It's at a low part of her yard, so when it rains heavily the pond and moat floods, and the water starts creeping up the fall of her patio, complete with swimming fish . If she's not losing water, then she's getting more than she wants . She'll have to install some drainage to divert surface run off.

Be aware that snakes find frogs an excellent aperitif

Originally Posted by Iain

Be aware that snakes find frogs an excellent aperitif

Unfortunately rats do too..<o =""></o>

Is it true frogs eat each other ?

Just an aside, that doesnt help much with the building of things but more in line with the "keeping" of your frogs, fish etc. Yes, snakes do enjoy a frog entree, as do ibis and water fowl. To discourage the birds from visiting, get a fake plastic heron to stand overlooking the pond. It works wonders. In the wild they are territorial birds and other birds realise this and dont bother to visit the pond as it is "taken"

sf

Originally Posted by pawnhead

My sister has a fantastic looking fish pond that she's just finished, but it has a few problems. She's losing a bit of water and she's not sure where. It could be a puncture in the membrane, and apparently there's some sort of clay product that you can put in the water that helps seal leaks. .

Hi Prawnhead,

The product you are talking about is called a Bentonite Blanket. Its Bentonite clay that forms a waterproof seal for ponds and dams. A bit expensive and hard to obtain in small quantities but fantastic if you really want to create a natural wetland look.

When I built mine I just used two layers of builders plastic to line the hole.
It worked OK but I didn't level the rim very well so the water will only settle to the lowest part of the rim.

You should be able to get bentonite in small quantities from a pottery supplier (or even a production potter)

Tony,
if you have cane toads in your area, be aware that if they lay their eggs in your pond it will poison any frog eggs and possibly the frogs themselves. If so, you'll need to erect some form of barrier around the pond, it doesn't need to be too high as toads only hop, not jump. Poor bloody frogs, between snakes, birds, rats and toads as well as habitat loss, chemicals in the water etc etc it's no wonder there's less and less o0f them around.

Mick

The bentonite blanket I mentioned is a layer of bentonite sandwiched between 2 layers of fabric. It comes in rolls. If you were using potters clay you would have to roll out the plastic clay to form a liner which sounds like a lot of work.
You would be better off sourcing a non dispersive clay from a local excavation site and asking for a ute's worth.
To tell if the clay is non dispersive grab a small blob, roll it into a ball and drop it in a glass of water. If after 10 minutes it is still sitting there its non dispersive and ideal for lining your pond.
If on the other hand the water is very cloudy and the blob of clay has slumped to the bottom of the glass or dissolved you have a dispersive clay which is no good.

Originally Posted by squashedfrog1

get a fake plastic heron to stand overlooking the pond. It works wonders. sf

Man that's a seriously funny tip...I laughed...

Does it have to be a heron could you use a pink flamingo or maybe an angry dwarf with a sword?

You could try to find a food grade (or similar) plastic mesh as an alternative to the gal mesh?

The marine aquarium industry uses plastic extensively with very sensitive organisms.....

Just a thought....

Joel

Just spoke to the duty Planning Officer at the council, he tells me that there is no restriction provided the water is less than 30 cm deep. Beyond that it requires a standard pool fence.

The common frog around here is the striped marsh frog, hardy little fellas, but I have seen Peron's tree frog occasionally too. I quite like the sound of them calling so no problem there. Plenty of snakes around as well (we're near the bush) but they're mainly red-bellied blacks and generally don't bother anyone as long as they're left alone.

Cane toads haven't got to Sydney (yet!) but they're predicted to make it sometime in the next decade I think. We'll see what happens.

Thanks for all the feedback. I'm off to start digging a hole!

Originally Posted by Tony Hunt

Cane toads haven't got to Sydney (yet!) but they're predicted to make it sometime in the next decade I think. We'll see what happens.

The drop bears will repel them!!!

Digging (more like quarrying in my front yard, nearly 50% rocks by volume) is about half done . Next, off to the physiotherapist!