Emission Trading and climate change

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  1. #9551
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    How much more of the global warming fraud do we must endure?
    How long until the wind turbines are demolished, the solar panels frown upon as a hobby and CO2 recognized for what it is, a life giving gas?

    How long until the scammers that promote reduction of CO2 as a "salvation" are dragged in court and thrown in gaol for fraud?
    How long until the green movement is recognized as a terrorist organisation?

    Did you put salt on your Corn Flakes again this morning?
    Joined RF in 2006...Resigned in 2020.

  2. #9552
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    Default Another interwsting e-mail today.

    This e-mail arrived today?

    CARBON DIOXIDE SOURCE

    Ian Rutherford Plimer is an Australian geologist, professor emeritus of earth sciences at the University of Melbourne, professor of mining geology at the University of Adelaide, and the director of multiple mineral exploration and mining companies. He has published 130 scientific papers, six books and edited the Encyclopedia of Geology.

    Born - 12 February 1946 (age 67)

    Residence - Australia

    Nationality - Australian

    Fields - Earth Science, Geology, Mining Engineering

    Institutions - University of New England,University of Newcastle,University of Melbourne,University of Adelaide

    Alma mater - University of New South Wales,Macquarie University

    Thesis - The pipe deposits of tungsten-molybdenum-bismuth in eastern Australia (1976)

    Notable awards - Eureka Prize (1995, 2002),Centenary Medal (2003), Clarke Medal (2004)

    Where Does the Carbon Dioxide Really Come From?
    Professor Ian Plimer could not have said it better!
    If you've read his book you will agree, this is a good summary.

    PLIMER: "Okay, here's the bombshell. The volcanic eruption in Iceland . Since its first spewing of volcanic ash has, in just FOUR DAYS, NEGATED EVERY SINGLE EFFORT you have made in the past five years to control CO2 emissions on our planet - all of you.

    Of course, you know about this evil carbon dioxide that we are trying to suppress - it’s that vital chemical compound that every plant requires to live and grow and to synthesize into oxygen for us humans and all animal life. I know....it's very disheartening to realize that all of the carbon emission savings you have accomplished while suffering the inconvenience and expense of driving Prius hybrids, buying fabric grocery bags, sitting up till midnight to finish your kids "The Green Revolution" science project, throwing out all of your non-green cleaning supplies, using only two squares of toilet paper, putting a brick in your toilet tank reservoir, selling your SUV and speedboat, vacationing at home instead of abroad, nearly getting hit every day on your bicycle, replacing all of your 50 cent light bulbs with $10.00 light bulbs.....well, all of those things you have done have all gone down the tubes in just four days.

    The volcanic ash emitted into the Earth's atmosphere in just four days - yes, FOUR DAYS - by that volcano in Iceland has totally erased every single effort you have made to reduce the evil beast, carbon. And there are around 200 active volcanoes on the planet spewing out this crud at any one time - EVERY DAY.

    I don't really want to rain on your parade too much, but I should mention that when the volcano Mt Pinatubo erupted in the Philippines in 1991, it spewed out more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere than the entire human race had emitted in all its years on earth.

    Yes, folks, Mt Pinatubo was active for over One year - think about it.

    Of course, I shouldn't spoil this 'touchy-feely tree-hugging' moment and mention the effect of solar and cosmic activity and the
    well-recognized 800-year global heating and cooling cycle, which keeps happening despite our completely insignificant efforts to affect climate change.
    And I do wish I had a silver lining to this volcanic ash cloud, but the fact of the matter is that the bush fire season across the western USA and Australia this year alone will negate your efforts to reduce carbon in our world for the next two to three years. And it happens every year.

    Just remember that your government just tried to impose a whopping carbon tax on you, on the basis of the bogus 'human-caused' climate-change scenario.





    Hey, isn’t it interesting how they don’t mention 'Global Warming' Anymore, but just 'Climate Change' - you know why?
    It’s because the planet has COOLED by 0.7 degrees in the past century and these global warming bull artists got caught with their pants down.

    And, just keep in mind that you might yet have an Emissions Trading Scheme - that whopping new tax - imposed on you that will achieve absolutely nothing except make you poorer.
    It won’t stop any volcanoes from erupting, that’s for sure.




    But, hey, relax......give the world a hug and have a nice day!"
























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  3. #9553
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    Things must be really tough in denierland if they are resorting to spam.

    Plimer still getting his spending money from Heartland? Maybe he's using it to fund spam...

    If you are truly wondering about the effect of volcanic eruptions, there is lots to read here: Volcanic Gases and Climate Change Overview

    The most significant climate impacts from volcanic injections into the stratosphere come from the conversion of sulfur dioxide to sulfuric acid, which condenses rapidly in the stratosphere to form fine sulfate aerosols. The aerosols increase the reflection of radiation from the Sun back into space, cooling the Earth's lower atmosphere or troposphere. Several eruptions during the past century have caused a decline in the average temperature at the Earth's surface of up to half a degree (Fahrenheit scale) for periods of one to three years. The climactic eruption of Mount Pinatubo on June 15, 1991, was one of the largest eruptions of the twentieth century and injected a 20-million ton (metric scale) sulfur dioxide cloud into the stratosphere at an altitude of more than 20 miles. The Pinatubo cloud was the largest sulfur dioxide cloud ever observed in the stratosphere since the beginning of such observations by satellites in 1978. It caused what is believed to be the largest aerosol disturbance of the stratosphere in the twentieth century, though probably smaller than the disturbances from eruptions of Krakatau in 1883 and Tambora in 1815. Consequently, it was a standout in its climate impact and cooled the Earth's surface for three years following the eruption, by as much as 1.3 degrees at the height of the impact. Sulfur dioxide from the large 1783-1784 Laki fissure eruption in Iceland caused regional cooling of Europe and North America by similar amounts for similar periods of time.
    Regarding CO2 from volcanoes:
    Do the Earth’s volcanoes emit more CO2 than human activities? Research findings indicate that the answer to this frequently asked question is a clear and unequivocal, “No.” Human activities, responsible for a projected 35 billion metric tons (gigatons) of CO2 emissions in 2010 (Friedlingstein et al., 2010), release an amount of CO2 that dwarfs the annual CO2 emissions of all the world’s degassing subaerial and submarine volcanoes (Gerlach, 2011).
    Interesting that Plimer has walked away from his previous claims regarding volcanic CO2 and now saying that volcanoes emit more than we save by reducing CO2 emissions. That may or may not be a fair comment, but the reality is we haven't really gotten started yet.

    woodbe.

  4. #9554
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    We discussed Plimer's book on this forum a year or two ago. The only thing that has changed since then is that people have had more time to document the errors in the book. One of the best lists of the flaws is here.
    http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rc...,d.dGI&cad=rja

  5. #9555
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodbe View Post
    The reason is:

    No Failure. Your failure perception system is lacking calibration.

    It's a good strategy to attack when your defences are down, but 16 years is not long enough to declare failure in a complex climate system. Claims of 'waffle' do not adequately address the points raised, which you have studiously ignored.

    If there is a failure here, it is that you have not explained your cherry picking:




    Unless you have something new to add, we're just repeating ourselves ad nauseum here, give it a rest.

    Next!

    woodbe
    all that waffle dodging a simple question, if you knew your stuff you would at least try & give a dodgy answer relative to the question, no need for the slippery tactics evading it.
    Your ideas, formulas, graphs & predictions do not represent what is actually happening, so this actually makes it anecdotal evidence.

    regards inter

  6. #9556
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    No dodging.

    The question was:

    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6
    so let's hear the excuse of why these so called proven precise graphs, formulas & predictions failing ??
    The answer is:

    No Failure. Your question is based on a false premise. The climate system is not based or analysed in 16 year periods, way too short.

    Even a total fool could see that the 16 year period for surface temps only is a cherry pick. You accept that the oceans have been warming during this cherry picked time, so what is your excuse for asking such a dumb question? Did your iPad eat your homework again?

    "Unless you have something new to add, we're just repeating ourselves ad nauseum here, give it a rest."

    woodbe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by woodbe View Post
    No dodging.

    The question was:



    The answer is:

    No Failure. Your question is based on a false premise. The climate system is not based or analysed in 16 year periods, way too short.

    don't worry the IPCC will have another revised report out in the near future with another lower expectation for all the alarmist dills out there

    Even a total fool could see that the 16 year period for surface temps only is a cherry pick. You accept that the oceans have been warming during this cherry picked time, so what is your excuse for asking such a dumb question? Did your iPad eat your homework again?

    That must be a coincidence because I just read about a ship load of fools with a strikingly similar idealism to yours.



    woodbe.
    regards inter

  8. #9558
    4K Club Member Marc's Avatar
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    Yes, the gravy train of unlimited funds if you mention climate change has stopped, the gravy dried out, the conga line of labor-green-commies still dances even when the music has stopped. The first country besides Cuba to BAN filament light bulbs is under new management.
    Yes they are pussyfooting around a lot when they should be cutting off all the so called environmental projects at once and cut off all foreign aid for good measure.
    Ask for a refund on all the subsidies towards "renewable" energy, and give an automatic one day in jail to any CEO who's company promotes earth hour.

    Aah how I miss the 50c 100 w light bulb! ... Come to think about it, I may slip a crate or two in my next container and give it away at Australia day.
    My very own contribution towards sanity... well that is besides my 8.2 litre Mercruiser engine in my boat.
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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  9. #9559
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    Global-warming ‘proof’ is evaporating

    By Michael Fumento
    December 5, 2013 | 12:14am

    Modal Trigger


    Photo: HO/AFP/Getty Images

    MORE ON:

    WEATHER


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    We've become weather wimps


    NYC finally thawing out with warmer temps on the way


    Pizzeria delivers medicine to home-bound amid Polar Vortex




    The 2013 hurricane season just ended as one of the five quietest years since 1960. But don’t expect anyone who pointed to last year’s hurricanes as “proof” of the need to act against global warming to apologize; the warmists don’t work that way.

    Warmist claims of a severe increase in hurricane activity go back to 2005 and Hurricane Katrina. The cover of Al Gore’s 2009 book, “Our Choice: A Plan to Solve the Climate Crisis,” even features a satellite image of the globe with four major hurricanes superimposed.

    Yet the evidence to the contrary was there all along. Back in 2005 I and others reviewed the entire hurricane record, which goes back over a century, and found no increase of any kind. Yes, we sometimes get bad storms — but no more frequently now than in the past. The advocates simply ignored that evidence — then repeated their false claims after Hurricane Sandy last year.
    And the media play along. For example, it somehow wasn’t front-page news that committed believers in man-made global warming recently admitted there’s been no surface global warming for well over a decade and maybe none for decades more. Nor did we see warmists conceding that their explanation is essentially a confession that the previous warming may not have been man-made at all.

    That admission came in a new paper by prominent warmists in the peer-reviewed journal Climate Dynamics. They not only conceded that average global surface temperatures stopped warming a full 15 years ago, but that this “pause” could extend into the 2030s.

    Mind you, the term “pause” is misleading in the extreme: Unless and until it resumes again, it’s just a “stop.” You don’t say a bullet-ridden body “paused” breathing.

    Remarkably, that stoppage has practically been a state secret. Just five years ago, the head of the International Panel on Climate Change, the group most associated with “proving” that global warming is man-made and has horrific potential consequences, told Congress that Earth is running a “fever” that’s “apt to get much worse.” Yet he and IPCC knew the warming had stopped a decade earlier.

    Those who pointed this out, including yours truly, were labeled “denialists.” Yet the IPCC itself finally admitted the “pause” in its latest report.

    The single most damning aspect of the “pause” is that, because it has occurred when “greenhouse gases” have been pouring into the atmosphere at record levels, it shows at the very least that something natural is at play here. The warmists suggest that natural factors have “suppressed” the warming temporarily, but that’s just a guess: The fact is, they have nothing like the understanding of the climate that they claimed (and their many models that all showed future warming mean nothing, since they all used essentially the same false information).

    If Ma Nature caused the “pause,” can’t this same lady be responsible for the warming observed earlier? You bet! Fact is, the earth was cooling and warming long before so-called GHGs could have been a factor. A warm spell ushered in the Viking Age, and many scientists believe recent warming was merely a recovery from what’s called “the Little Ice Age” that began around 1300.

    Yet none of this unsettles the rush to kill debate. The Los Angeles Times has even announced that it will no longer print letters to the editor questioning man-made global warming. Had the Times been printing before Columbus, perhaps it would have banned letters saying the Earth was round.

    Meanwhile, the Obama administration continues to push to reduce supposed global-warming emissions. Last month, the president even signed an executive order establishing a Council on Climate Preparedness and Resilience that could dramatically expand government bureaucrats’ ability to restrict Americans’ use of their property, water and energy to reduce so-called “greenhouse gas emissions.”

    Such attempted reductions in other countries have proved incredibly expensive, while barely reducing emissions. But damn the stubbornly weak economy, says President Obama, full speed ahead!

    This, even as new data show that last year the US median wage hit its lowest level since 1998 and long-term unemployment is almost the highest ever.

    People have a right to religious and cult beliefs within reason. But the warmists have been proved wrong time and again, each time reacting with little more than pictures of forlorn polar bears on ice floes and trying to shut down the opposition. (More bad timing: Arctic ice increased by almost a third this past year, while that at the South Pole was thicker and wider than it’s been in 35 years.)

    In war and in science, the bloodiest conflicts always seem to be the religious ones. Time for the American public to say it’s no longer going to play the victim in this one.
    Michael Fumento is a journalist and attorney based in Colombia.

    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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  10. #9560
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    You are here:
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    Tom Switzer: Game Finally Up For Carboncrats

    Historians will probably look back at the years 2006-2009 as the time when the climate hysteria reached its peak, when rational debate was at its most restricted and politicians... Read More

    • Date: 13/01/14
    • Tom Switzer, The Sydney Morning Herald










    42265.8K



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    ...and somewhere, deep behind an almost impenetrable fog, a little dog barked...
    Joined RF in 2006...Resigned in 2020.

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    Just in case you were wondering...



    Comes at the bottom of Tamino's 3rd tutorial on data smoothing: Smooth 3 | Open Mind

    woodbe.

  13. #9563
    4K Club Member Marc's Avatar
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    I know people who believe that placing a mirror or a CD in front of their house will reflect away envy or bad luck. There is no point in arguing against such absurd belief. The logic behind believing is rooted in the past, unknown to the person doing the believing. Current events are cherry-picked only to prop up the original belief, not consciously mind you, yet that is the mechanism.

    I had some Catholic friends who believed that Saint Anthony would bring them a girl friend, St Cono will bring a Lotto win and Saint Gaetano will help to find work. Perfectly harmless beliefs just like the mirror, the black cat or the salt over the left shoulder.

    What happens when influential people get together and exploit harmless beliefs for their own purposes? Simple, you get an industry that flourishes behind beliefs... or is it beyond belief? THis is not new. For millennia artisans have been commissioned to make paintings, statues, amulets, and all sort of paraphernalia used by believers to support their particular faith.

    The global warming fraud industry is no different. The grass root mass of people ready to believe whatever fits their preconceived mind set, shaped way in the past before age 10 is there ready to be prompted. Organisations brandishing the banner of "altruism" come out with a litany of absurd and unproved claims and accusations against those that are hated the most, those that stand on their own feet, those who are successful, those who are entrepreneurial and millions take to it like a house on fire. A cause is born to be believed or denied. No proof required. BELIEVE !!!

    How Many People Died for Your Green Consumer Fix
    January 23, 2013 • 10:57AM


    In January 2011, the Obama Administration unveiled its new ecolabel, "USDA Certified Biobased Product," with a logo of a rising sun over sloping fields, to go on various qualified consumer products, along with a figure giving the percent of the inputs which came from agriculture, instead of that farm output going into food for people. This advance will now aid you to figure exactly how many lives have been terminated, to provide you with green products. Such bioproducts range from disposable plastic plates (corn), to paint (soy), ink (soy), glue (milk), and construction materials (various crops)— all made from food or other farm biomass.


    For example, if you use a home floor cleaner, with the ecologo listing an agri-green percent of 50%, that means that by using this product, you can feel glad you helped get rid of, maybe, one or two people somewhere, who died for lack of food. Thus you do your bit to help relieve the Earth of too many eaters.

    A really high agri-green input percentage, e.g., on large items, such as soybean oil candles — at 80% — for a cathedral at Christmas, might, for example, knock off 12 Ethiopians. You can then feel really good and green, the way Sir David Attenborough does.


    In the 1970s, the environmentalist movement was fostered internationally, cooked up in the social-manipulation labs of the neo-British Empire, to promote the lie that people pollute, and the world must be de-populated. Go green.


    In the 2000s, this began to be insinuated into U.S. agriculture law. In the 2002 five-year farm law, a program called "BioPreferred" was started, to push bioproducts in the US Department of Agriculture's in-house Federal purchasing program. This was expanded in the 2008 law (Food Conservation and Energy Act of 2008).


    But when Obama came into office in 2009, this green operation was ramped up to real killer levels. In fact, the USDA ecolabel is not even required for ethanol, because it is so extensive; corn-ethanol now takes over 42% of the entire yearly corn harvest, whose loss for food accounts for millions of deaths. Nor is the ecolabel required for biodiesel, which takes 26% of annual U.S. soybean oil. The Obama Administration is also pushing sorghum-for-biofuels.


    Some final details, FYI. Cotton tee shirts and similar traditional bio-products, in use as of 1972, are grandfathered in, and don't qualify for the "USDA Certified Biobased Product." But 900 biobased product certifications are now valid, as of December 31, 2012. They include cosmetics, packaging, vehicle maintenance — so many ways you can take food away from people. The USDA offers a catalog of bioproducts. Go on line for green death: www.biopreferred.gov



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  14. #9564
    4K Club Member Marc's Avatar
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    What's the point of posting temperature graphs?
    Who cares that temperature varies? Do you? Hot in summer, cold in winter, it has been so since we where born.
    Oh ... sorry ... forgot ... you IMPLY ... how could I forget ... that we, specifically ME is at fault for the temperature to be hotter then 100 years ago. Stop breathing Marc, it's all your fault.

    Yes, you can blow until you are red in the face yet that does not change the fact that your assertion, direct or by elevation, falls in the same category of the CD nailed above the front door to reflect bad luck. It may make you feel good, it may support your belief that includes vilifying a part of the population you despise, it may make you new friends, it may even pay you a living as a priest of this new religion, yet all of the above does not make it true.

    Fortunately for me who will continue to fart at my heart content, use the biggest and meanest engines I can afford, buy 100W and 150W incandescent lamps use the aircon as much as I want (subsidised by your green friends who paid for my roof panels) and last but not least, buy caged eggs since the free range industry is yet another con.

    You can post temperature graphs as much as you like, they are probably incorrect, but even if they are right and it is hotter or rather it was hotter, what is your point? Fending off bad luck?
    Be my guest. I am very amused.
    Try rubbing a pregnant woman's belly. It's supposed to bring good luck!


    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    I'm surprised this wacker hasn't mentioned Soylent Green, it cuts out the middle man, and we wouldn't even need agriculture for it.

    Marc, is this all your own work or are you plagiarising someone else's work by cutting and pasting and not attributing your source?

    Belay that. I guess if I posted this amount of boundless twaddle I wouldn't post the source either.

    woodbe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    What's the point of posting temperature graphs?
    Who cares that temperature varies? Do you? Hot in summer, cold in winter, it has been so since we where born.
    Oh ... sorry ... forgot ... you IMPLY ... how could I forget ... that we, specifically ME is at fault for the temperature to be hotter then 100 years ago. Stop breathing Marc, it's all your fault.
    The point of temperature graphs, dear Marc, is that they are graphical representations of historical temperature data. I don't know how old you are, Marc, but the data collection goes well back before I or you were a kid, and tells a story about what is happening across the country, the planet.

    Anecdotally, I thought it was pretty hot in summer when I was a kid. Was it hotter or cooler than recent years, no way of accurately telling unless as a kid I had the forethought to get hold of a calibrated thermometer and a stephenson's screen and record the temperature many times a day for my whole life (which wouldn't have been long due to boredom, lol) I didn't do that, so I rely on the fact that this has been done by a bunch of dedicated people for ages, long enough to get a handle on the changes in the temperature.

    As for blame and guilt, I couldn't care less. I've blamed you for not sourcing your quotes, not breathing...

    woodbe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    What's the point of posting temperature graphs?
    Who cares that temperature varies? Do you? Hot in summer, cold in winter, it has been so since we where born.
    Oh ... sorry ... forgot ... you IMPLY ... how could I forget ... that we, specifically ME is at fault for the temperature to be hotter then 100 years ago. Stop breathing Marc, it's all your fault.

    Actually...it has never been about you. Despite what you might think...you are just not that important or significant.

    Unfortunately and regrettably, you are no more significant than myself or Woodbe or any other single individual with respect to human-induced climate change. And I can't imagine why you would think otherwise...or why you would want to
    Joined RF in 2006...Resigned in 2020.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post

    How Many People Died for Your Green Consumer Fix
    January 23, 2013 • 10:57AM


    In January 2011, the Obama Administration unveiled its new ecolabel....blah, blah, blah

    You compare the Green movement to the Catholic Church and then you spout from the Gospel of LaRouche? Is there any irony left in this World?
    Joined RF in 2006...Resigned in 2020.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    What's the point of posting temperature graphs?
    Who cares that temperature varies? Do you? Hot in summer, cold in winter, it has been so since we where born.
    Oh ... sorry ... forgot ... you IMPLY ... how could I forget ... that we, specifically ME is at fault for the temperature to be hotter then 100 years ago. Stop breathing Marc, it's all your fault.

    Yes, you can blow until you are red in the face yet that does not change the fact that your assertion, direct or by elevation, falls in the same category of the CD nailed above the front door to reflect bad luck. It may make you feel good, it may support your belief that includes vilifying a part of the population you despise, it may make you new friends, it may even pay you a living as a priest of this new religion, yet all of the above does not make it true.

    Fortunately for me who will continue to fart at my heart content, use the biggest and meanest engines I can afford, buy 100W and 150W incandescent lamps use the aircon as much as I want (subsidised by your green friends who paid for my roof panels) and last but not least, buy caged eggs since the free range industry is yet another con.

    You can post temperature graphs as much as you like, they are probably incorrect, but even if they are right and it is hotter or rather it was hotter, what is your point? Fending off bad luck?
    Be my guest. I am very amused.
    Try rubbing a pregnant woman's belly. It's supposed to bring good luck!


    It would pay to remember that farting to your hearts content does nothing more than offend those close to you. You write offended but say you are amused, you can't have it both ways. You hate anything green but have solar panels, what a mass of contradiction you really are, lastly this was never about you, do you think in the scheme of things you actually matter, you don't, like everyone else you are just a tiny possibly redundant cog in a sea of life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    You compare the Green movement to the Catholic Church and then you spout from the Gospel of LaRouche? Is there any irony left in this World?
    I should have known where this came from when I saw the term 'neo British Empire" It's all part of the Lyndon Larouche revelation that global warming was a conspiracy by the British royal family and jewish banking interests to weaken the US and protect the role of the queen of England as a major drug dealer while Prince Philip gets rid of annoying relatives like Diana and organises the US military to destroy the world trade centre. No wonder Marc doesn't want to say where he gets his cut and pastes.
    Views of Lyndon LaRouche and the LaRouche movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    More nuts than a Snickers bar

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    Yes, yes, very funny everyone, how predictable.
    Anyone writing against the green idiocy is a "nut case". Typically when your arguments are indefensible, you attempt to discredit the writer. Conceded, some writers don't need much help in that area, yet you should explain why they are wrong (if you can) rather than making reference to their character. After all a drunkard can have very valuable opinions in relation to alcoholism.

    Fortunately for me and the millions of people who think like me, the conga line of green-labor-commie has run out of music and are now bumping into each other in a discordant cacophony of words.

    The global warming rebaptised climate change, rebaptised rapid climate change has long be unmasked as a fraud, created for political purposes, exploiting the gullible and the vast numbers of those who are on the prowl for a cause to support with too much time on their hand.

    Yes there are exaggerations on both camps. Yet since you lot have quoted high wide and handsome every demented claim you can possibly find, indulge me when I quote some nut cases of my liking. After all the enemy of my enemies is my friend ... even if he belongs in the funny farm.

    In the end all it matters is the truth that inevitably comes out. We already know the alarmist claims of the past were a fraud invented to cement grants to push forward a very profitable industry. The pretend cause and effect between man made CO2 and temperature, busted to kingdom kong. CO2 clearly not the villain, everything else falls down like a house of cards.

    Of course any amount of logic does not resonate with quasi religious convictions and even less with the left who having seen the spectacular fall of their bastion countries like russia and satellites, and the embrace of capitalism in china and Vietnam, as the only viable option to survive, still press on with their constant ideological sabotage.
    Wasn't the recent Labor/Green experiment enough?

    The reality is very simple as usual. Climate changes, yes. It has been changing for the last how many billions of years way before humans walked the earth.

    Human activity is like an ameba on the back of an african elephant, completely irrelevant to the climate mechanism.

    CO2 is an essential gas for life, the more the merrier within reason.
    Currently it is at an historic LOW having been way higher with no ill effect and producing optimisation of the flora and consequently fauna.

    If CO2 is a beneficial gas, then what are we doing subsidising idiotic white elephants like wind mills and why do you pay me 3 times the retail value of electricity to produce a piffy amount of solar energy? Answer political/religious convictions that bears no relation with anything logic that would make any difference to the environment. My solar panels are the equivalent to candles or incense on the altar of the deity of choice, placed on my roof with the help of an insane bribe.

    Then again we have gone down this path before. If people can believe that a stain on the wall will heal them if they touch it, it is much easier to believe that the bad rich are choking the "planet" with their "emissions".

    And so I will continue emitting everything I can to make my life more comfortable and in the process create a market for my suppliers who in this way pay their mortgage and their kids private school happily playing in the shelter of structures paid 3 or 4 times its real value with subsidies supported for ideological reasons.
    As you can see everything has a place in life, yes even my "emissions".
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Yes, yes, very funny everyone, how predictable.
    Anyone writing against the green idiocy is a "nut case". Typically when your arguments are indefensible, you attempt to discredit the writer. Conceded, some writers don't need much help in that area, yet you should explain why they are wrong (if you can) rather than making reference to their character. After all a drunkard can have very valuable opinions in relation to alcoholism.
    Oh so pityingly self-righteous...you don't appreciate the 'nutcase' suggestion any more than others here appreciate being considered 'greenie leftist terrorists who should be jailed or shot' by you.

    Has it occurred to you that if you don't post such nonsense then we might not make such suggestions in the first place? Try a little well considered self censorship on occasion instead of simply running off your hippocampus...see where that gets you.
    Joined RF in 2006...Resigned in 2020.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    Oh so pityingly self-righteous...you don't appreciate the 'nutcase' suggestion any more than others here appreciate being considered 'greenie leftist terrorists who should be jailed or shot' by you.

    Has it occurred to you that if you don't post such nonsense then we might not make such suggestions in the first place? Try a little well considered self censorship on occasion instead of simply running off your hippocampus...see where that gets you.
    Rubbish, still waiting for a detailed rebuttal of any of the third party claims I posted. Also about any of my own claims.

    Hippocampus or hipercampus, CO2 is and will remain a beneficial gas and so all the rest of the puffed up claims of catastrophe are bogus. Is it a conspiracy? May be yes may be no, who cares? It is still bogus and no amount of dancing around the subject of "peer reviewed" or not will change that unconfortable truth.

    Why don't we jail fraudster who have scammed billions from taxpayers?
    Because most authorities are involved going along with it for political convenience. Conspiracy or not, Man made Global Warming is and remains a fraud and the sooner people come to terms with the fact that their crusade was ill conceived the better. Take up a crusade against additives and preservatives in food. That may be of some benefit to humans if people can come to terms with actually caring for humans rather than rocks.
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    For someone who spends most of his time shooting the messenger in his own posts and posting what really in many cases is little more than a series of insults with some very dodgy figures and unsupported conclusions it is a bit rich to expect others to overlook that level of anti social behaviour and try to isolate anything worth commenting on. Many of those ill tempered posts don't even contain anything approaching rebuttal they are what the are snarly ravings that deride those of another opinion to your own, has it occurred to you we actually treat you better than you treat anyone else whose opinion does not meet your approval.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Why don't we jail fraudster who have scammed billions from taxpayers?
    We do Marc. And for a lot less than billions, so such a large case should be easy to prove? In our society, we need to use our legal system to do this. To bring a case, you have to have evidence of a fraud. Feel free to go ahead if you have evidence that Climate Change is a fraud.

    I think you might wear some costs though, there is a lot of evidence that it is not a fraud, and precious little evidence that it is. We've aired this evidence here, but apparently you don't have any science in your reading preferences.

    Glad to be hearing some actual words from Marc in any case.

    woodbe.

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    Yes, I posted this because I like to know if the author's aunty had an affair with a member of the Kenyan royal family or if his father was paid by the russian mafia to sell adulterated vodka to the Eskimos and if he was part owner of the Exon Valdez or if his daughter has a Mink coat.












    You are here: HomeNews › Eleven Global Warming Stories From 2013 You Probably Never Heard Of

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    Eleven Global Warming Stories From 2013 You Probably Never Heard Of

    December 30, 2013 | Filed under: News, Opinion, Uncategorized
    By Elmer Beauregard
    If you get your news from the likes of The Huffington Post and the New York Times here are some stories about Global Warming that occurred in 2013 that you probably never heard of.

    1. Antarctic Global Warming Expedition Ship Trapped in Sea Ice. You may have heard about the Russian vessel trapped 100 miles away from land in 10 feet thick ice in Antarctica and how three ice breakers have failed to rescue it. What you may not have heard is this ship is filled with Climate Scientists studying Global Warming. They are comparing data from 100 years ago when there was no sea ice in the same location.

    2. Yachts Trapped in Sea Ice in the Arctic Last Summer.
    You probably didn’t hear about all the yachts, sailboats, rowboats, and kayaks that got trapped by sea ice while trying to sail the fabled Northwest Passage. They were promised an ice free passage.


    3. Global Sea Ice at Record Levels.
    Al Gore and John Kerry 5 years ago predicted that 2013 would be ice free in the arctic. You probably haven’t heard that the exact opposite came true. 2013 is currently at the second highest volume of sea ice ever recorded and will probably break the all time record before the season is over.


    4. Half of Meteorologists Don’t Believe in Global Warming.
    Nearly half of meteorologists and atmospheric science experts don’t believe that human activities are the driving force behind global warming, according to a survey by the American Meteorological Society.


    5. Only 75 “Climate Scientists” Believe in Global Warming.
    You probably have heard ad nauseum that 97% percent of “Climate Scientists” believe in global warming. That stat was based on a study which counted only 75 of 77 “Climate Scientists”. Compared to the over 31,000 scientists who have signed a petition saying they don’t believe in Global Warming. That’s only 2.3 in 1,000 or .23% of scientists that actually believe in Global Warming.


    6. NASA caught fudging historical temps to make it look like the globe is warming.
    By massively cooling the past in their recent graphs, NASA has exaggerated the amount of warming they report by nearly twice as much as they did 13 years ago.


    7. Polar Bar Population at Record Levels.
    Since we’ve been keeping count the Polar Bear population is estimated at a record high of 20k to 25k. 5,000 are expected to be born around the New Year in Russia alone.


    8. Obama Allows Wind Farms to Kill Eagles Without Penalties.
    Over 50 years ago the green movement started with the book “Silent Spring” which alleged that DDT was killing the Bald Eagle. Now we have come full circle by allowing wind power companies to kill eagles without penalty because it’s “good for the planet”.


    9. The Oceans Aren’t Rising.
    Remember in 2009 when the officials of the Maldives held a press conference under water to show that their islands were sinking because of global warming. Well a new study done in 2013 shows that there is nothing to worry about.


    10. 2013 Was The Least Extreme U.S. Weather Year Ever.
    2013 shatters the record for fewest U.S. tornadoes, 15% lower than previous record. 2013 also had the fewest U.S. forest fires since 1984.


    11. No Global Warming For Over 17 Years.
    The RSS monthly global mean lower-troposphere temperature anomalies for November 1996 to October 2013 had shown no global warming for exactly 204 months – the first dataset to show the full 17 years without warming specified by Ben Santer as showing the models got it wrong.



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    The future of wind turbines... can not come soon enough.
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post


    The future of wind turbines... can not come soon enough.

    GREAT PLASTERING TIPS AT


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    lol.

    Seems that Marc's dog whistle to the [S]deniers[/S] skeptics reeled one in.

    Here in SA, we're very happy with our alternate energy thanks. 41% of SA's power demand in the third quarter of 2013 was generated by wind, and our use of Coal is declining. We are also exporting more to other states (Vic).

    This is the way it should be for the whole country. As technology improves we should be embracing it, not holding on to it at all costs.



    Wind farms in South Australia: a page of Wind in the Bush

    woodbe.

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    STOP THESE THINGS
    THE TRUTH ABOUT WIND FARMS IN AUSTRALIA










    You are here: Home / Alan Jones / Dr Alan Watts – pure & simple: “it’s Fraud”
    Dr Alan Watts – pure & simple: “it’s Fraud”

    December 10, 2013 by stopthesethings 5 Comments

    Here’s STT Champion, Alan Jones talking with Dr Alan Watts about the great Australian wind power fraud.
    Alan has a little radio show that more than just a few Australians tune into each morning. Syndicated through over 77 Stations and with close to 2 million listeners Countrywide – AJ as he’s known – is one of those people that leads the political charge on many issues that really affect ordinary Australians and which the rest of the press ignore.
    The first piece has AJ ripping the fraud to pieces all by himself (7.08):
    In this segment AJ is joined by STT Champion, Dr Alan Watts OAM – no punches are pulled (10.27):
    Dr Watts made the following obvious points (points repeatedly ignored by those we pay to serve and protect us):

    • the government exists to ensure safe food, clean water and the health of a nation – fundamentals that are being ignored
    • wind energy is a fraud on a proportion that is beyond belief
    • sleep deprivation caused by turbine generated infrasound and low frequency noise is a serious public health issue
    • legal decision at Falmouth found wind turbines caused ‘irreparable damage to people’s health’
    • it’s nothing but ideology that drives wind energy
    • NSW planning and health departments are deliberately withholding key documents about turbine noise and its impacts on sleep and health – documents that should be disclosed to the public.

    Dr Alan Watts OAM
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    Filed Under: Alan Jones, Audio, Australia, Big wind industry, Big wind politics,Health Tagged With: Alan Jones, Alan Watts, infrasound, low frequency noise,wind farms, wind power, wind power fraud

    « Johnny “Rotten” Rau cops a Keyneton “Rocket”
    British “Turbine-Toffs” reap cash-Bonanza at punters’ expense »

    About stopthesethings
    We are a group of citizens concerned about the rapid spread of industrial wind power generation installations across Australia.

    Comments

    • E Griffiths says:
      January 13, 2014 at 2:16 am

      Geoff Leventhall (who was mentioned in the interview by Dr Alan Watts) also conducted a literature review for DEFRA (Dept of Environment, Food & Rural Affairs in the UK) in 2003.
      Leventhall made a couple of passing comments on the low frequency research conducted by NASA in his paper, yet he never reviewed any of the research conducted from 1979 into the 1990′s.
      Had he done so, the British govt (equally as blatantly greenwashed as the Australian govt), would have known about the meticulous pioneering research conducted by Dr N D Kelley, Willshire, Hubbard and others in the 1980s.
      This research, as has been pointed out by contributors to your radio program, proved that low frequency noise (LFN) and infrasound (ILFN) DOES damage people’s health, and that health problems worsen with cumulative exposure. The research by Willshire (1985) also proved that ILFN can easily travel 10km with little loss in power.
      The British govt still stands by the 2003 literature review by Leventhall as evidence for its stance that wind farm LFN is not injurious to human health (I have a letter from a govt minister, dated Feb 2013, stating the govt’s stance).
      It’s obvious to me that the British govt and windustry brown nosers (as in Australia & elsewhere) have so much credibility to lose they are lying through their teeth to protect their shattered reputations – it’s a case of the “when you’re in a hole, keep digging” mentality. They know they’ve lost the arguments, yet they’re defending their positions because they will have no livelihood if they come out & admit their mistakes.
      The wind industry brown nosers have so much to lose that they continue to screw the rural population and subject them to intolerable TORTURE (against the UN convention of human rights) to protect their own positions.
      The only way I can see to stop the gargantuan fraud and to stop the govts commiting what is tantamount to “treason” (I do not use this term lightly) against its own people is to demand written guarantees from developers, acousticians, brown nosing medical “experts”, planners and inspectors that wind farms will not harm people’s health.
      Seeking damages from the fraud facilitators and perpetrators in court is the only course of action I can envisage that would stand a chance of success – but it will be a dirty battle.
      Although I’m not a qualified acoustician, I have learned a lot on the subject over the last 7 years. It was 7 years ago when my wife first started hearing unexplained LFN in our home. This coincided with a 16 turbine wind farm being built 40km from our home.
      Since then more turbines have been built closer to our home, more are under construction, and yet more have recently been granted planning permission.
      I watched my wife be ill for over a month last summer, with sumptoms identical to those suffering from cumulative low frequency. The symptoms started several days into a spell of stable non turbulent atmosphere associated with a high pressure system, and progressively worsened over time. She was hearing LFN constantly and noticeably during this period. She was even forced to camp outdoors to reduce exposure to LFN.
      She only started regaining her health a few days after the weather broke and the LFN diminished in intensity significantly. It took her about 10-14 day to regain her health.
      This she experienced with the nearest wind farm 13 km from our home. We don’t know how much longer we’ll be able to live in our quiet rural home once the other wind turbines are up and running, with a good number being even closer to our home. Where can we go to get away from the LFN? Nowhere in Wales, except perhaps if we moved into one of the big cities.
      I can’t stand by and do nothing after seeing what can happen to my wife when exposed to excessive LFN. She can easily hear LFN indoors at distances of at least 50 km.





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    Wind farm scam a huge cover-up
    by: James Delingpole From:The Australian May 03, 2012 12:00AM

    ONE of the great popular misconceptions about climate-change sceptics such as Ian Plimer, Bob Carter, Cardinal George Pell and me is that we're all Big-Oil-funded, Gaia-ravaging, nature-hating emissaries of Satan. We can't look at a lovely pristine beach, apparently, without praying for a nice, juicy oil slick to turn up and wipe out all the pelicans and turtles and sea otters.

    But this isn't actually true. I love our beautiful planet at least as much as your $180,000-a-year (for a three-day week) climate commissioner Tim Flannery does. One of my great heroes is Patrick Moore, the Canadian co-founder of Greenpeace with whose sensible, rational approach to environmental issues I agree 100 per cent. Another of my heroes, after an article headlined "Where eagles dare not fly" in The Weekend Australian on April 21, is this newspaper's environment editor Graham Lloyd.

    It took great courage for Lloyd to write up his expose of the tremendous damage being caused by a wind farm to a small community in Waterloo, north of Adelaide. Most newspaper environment editors -- from Australia to Britain and the US -- tend, unfortunately, to be so ideologically wedded to the supposed virtues of renewable energy they find it all but impossible to criticise it.

    Lloyd interviewed a number of victims whose lives had been ruined by the vast, swooshing wind towers looking over their homes. They found sleep almost impossible; they couldn't concentrate; they had night sweats, headaches, palpitations, heart trouble. Their chickens were laying eggs without yolks; their ewes were giving birth to deformed lambs; their once-active dogs spent their days staring blankly at the wall. The damage, it seems, is caused not so much by the noise you can hear but by what you can't hear: the infrasonic waves that attack the balance mechanism in the ear and against which not even home insulation can defend you. Its effects can be felt more than 10km away.

    Inspired by Lloyd's article, I went to investigate and was heartbroken by what I found. Until you've seen what it can do to people, it's easy to dismiss wind turbine syndrome as a hypochondriac's charter or an urban myth. But it's real all right. Waterloo felt like a ghost town: shuttered houses and a dust-blown aura of sinister unease, as in a horror movie when something dreadful has happened to a previously ordinary, happy settlement and at first you're not sure what. Then you look up on to the horizon and see them, turning slowly in the breeze . . .

    Even more shocking than this, though, were my discoveries about the finance arrangements and behaviour of the wind farm companies. What we have here, I believe, is the biggest and most outrageous public affairs scandal of the 21st century -- one in which the Gillard government is implicated and that far exceeds in seriousness and scope of the Slipper or Thomson sideshows.

    At the heart of this scandal are the union superannuation funds that are using the wind farm scam as a kind of government-endorsed Ponzi scheme to fill their coffers at public expense. One of the biggest wind farm developers -- Pacific Hydro -- is owned by the union superfund Members Equity Bank. To meet its carbon reduction quotas, we're told, Australia needs to build about 10,000 new wind turbines like the ones that have destroyed Waterloo (and dozens of communities like it from NSW to South Australia).

    The figures are mind-boggling. Each of those turbines will cost about $3 million, which means $30 billion even before you've started building the power lines. And where's this money coming from? The consumer, of course -- mostly via tariffs whacked on to the price of conventional, fossil-fuel energy prices, in the form of payouts called Renewable Energy Certificates.

    Note that wind turbines produce very little power. Because wind is intermittent, they operate at between one-fifth and one-third of their capacity, meaning they are erratic, unreliable and have to be fully backed up by conventional "black" (mostly coal-fuelled) power. Where the money is to be made is through the REC subsidy. A 3MW wind turbine that generates (at most) $150,000 worth of electricity a year is eligible for guaranteed subsidies of $500,000 a year. A ridgeline hosting 20 or 30 turbines generates very little power -- but an awful lot of free cash for those lucky enough to get their snouts in the trough.

    If the unions were merely exploiting government environmental legislation to milk the taxpayer it would be bad enough: but what makes the wind farm scam so scandalous are the public health issues. Why aren't we more aware of these? Because there have been cover-ups on an epic scale. The owners on whose land the turbines are built are subject to rigorous gagging orders (from law firms such as Julia Gillard's ex-company, Slater & Gordon); tame experts are paid huge sums to testify that there are no health implications; inquiries are rigged; victims are rehoused and silenced with million-dollar payoffs. The global wind farm industry -- a cash cow for everyone from Labor's unions to the mafia -- is so massive it can afford it.

    Meanwhile the rest of us lose. Communities are divided, landscapes blighted, birds and bats sliced and diced, property values destroyed, lives ruined to deal with a "problem" -- anthropogenic CO2 causing "global warming" -- which most current evidence tells us doesn't even exist.

    As a NSW sheep farmer fighting tooth and nail to stop a wind farm development near his beloved home told me the other day in trenchant style: "The wind-farm business is bloody well near a pedophile ring. They're f . . king our families and knowingly doing so."

    James Delingpole's Killing the Earth to Save It (How Environmentalists are Ruining the Planet, Destroying the Economy and Stealing Your Jobs) is out now (Connor Court Publishing).

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/opinion/wind-farm-scam-a-huge-c...


    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    Oh yes, wind farms are unreliable. So how on earth did they supply 41% of the SA electricity in one quarter?

    Because they are not the only component of electricity supply, they are still an infant power source but they are showing their value. SA is on track to have 50% alternate energy supply by 2020 or before. Wind, Geothermal and Solar.

    We have a way to go, Denmark wind power is already at 30% annual demand and growing. SA is about 25% and also growing.



    Wait until offshore wind gets going in SA and we get serious about geothermal and concentrated solar.

    While the shock jocks are whining with fringe issues, the world passes them by, except for the occasional libel case that sends them or their rat nests broke.

    Inspired by Lloyd's article, I went to investigate and was heartbroken by what I found. Until you've seen what it can do to people, it's easy to dismiss wind turbine syndrome as a hypochondriac's charter or an urban myth. But it's real all right. Waterloo felt like a ghost town: shuttered houses and a dust-blown aura of sinister unease, as in a horror movie when something dreadful has happened to a previously ordinary, happy settlement and at first you're not sure what. Then you look up on to the horizon and see them, turning slowly in the breeze . . .
    LOL. Clearly, Delingpole never went to waterloo BEFORE the windfarms. James doesn't have time to read science, like Marc he's an interpreter of interpretations



    Zip through to the 5:00 minute mark, and do try not to laugh out loud.


    woodbe.

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    In Vic one of our big heat caused failures was Loy Yang A, or more to the point one of its coal powered generators. Good to see Marc using Alan Jones, the font of all knowledge to all those with an IQ smaller than their shoe size. get with it Marc we now have a multitude of power generation sources for power which means when we lost a major producer we can still crank out enough from other providers although it will hurt the retailers the cost of wholesale power went up 1500%, that is not a miss print but an amusing number. it will not impact on the retailers that much but the price shift is demand driven nothing else. the inter state energy grid helped as well as we dragged all the wind driven power we could out of SA to help. Doesn't quite line up with Jones's lies does it.

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    Just a thing to point out, from a casual observation the media, moreover the ones that influence the mainstream western global media are seeming to jump off the AGW ship & are seeming to remove a lot of support for the alarmism crowd, whether it's true or not they can bury whatever they like for a long time & reverse the politics of the argument.
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Just a thing to point out, from a casual observation the media, moreover the ones that influence the mainstream western global media are seeming to jump off the AGW ship & are seeming to remove a lot of support for the alarmism crowd, whether it's true or not they can bury whatever they like for a long time & reverse the politics of the argument.
    regards inter
    We'll all be rooned said Hanrahan.

    Rod's been saying the same thing for YEARS. Unfortunately, the science hasn't reflected the bias in the media. For some strange reason, they are more interested in selling subscriptions and advertising. I've been suggesting following the science instead of the media for about as long.

    Maybe the science follows the opinion in the media, it'll all change soon, right? lol.

    woodbe.

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    I mustn't be the average run of the mill nincompoop not to realise that the reason wholesale electricity prices went up tenfold was because of the inept govts ability get into so much debt, then they think "where can we get our hands on some easy cash" " lets make us the statutory electricity producer a corporation that make a profit which pays it to the govt & then let's sell it to try & balance the books for our ineptness" mmmm the trouble is the idiots are crippling industry & the worst off in society ( pensioners ) .
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by woodbe View Post
    We'll all be rooned said Hanrahan.

    Rod's been saying the same thing for YEARS. Unfortunately, the science hasn't reflected the bias in the media. For some strange reason, they are more interested in selling subscriptions and advertising. I've been suggesting following the science instead of the media for about as long.

    Maybe the science follows the opinion in the media, it'll all change soon, right? lol.

    woodbe.
    a living example of the saying that " reality is just an illusion caused by the lack of drugs"
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    a living example of the saying that " reality is just an illusion caused by the lack of drugs"
    regards inter
    Well, tell me what you're smoking.

    woodbe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    I mustn't be the average run of the mill nincompoop not to realise that the reason wholesale electricity prices went up tenfold was because of the inept govts ability get into so much debt, then they think "where can we get our hands on some easy cash" " lets make us the statutory electricity producer a corporation that make a profit which pays it to the govt & then let's sell it to try & balance the books for our ineptness" mmmm the trouble is the idiots are crippling industry & the worst off in society ( pensioners ) .
    regards inter
    Actually although I am no supporter of the privatisation of utilities the wholesale value of power hasn't gone up massively it is actually the retail end and this is because a lot of the price increases are for poles and wires and also of course other contributors which include the carbon tax and green schemes.

    There is no point building generation capacity for a random event, the capital cost is prohibitive, the retailers will absorb the difference spread over the year it will balance out with periods of cheap prices to the point it becomes insignificant. Heatwaves kill the frail, they increase power usage but not prices to pensioners. There is no evidence that selling off the networks led to higher prices, it was a need to upgrade the network that did that, I see nothing convincing that power prices would have been less. However what it has done is remove the dividends once enjoyed by state governments and that has hurt us as taxpayers.

    Our power now though is to expensive and a review is overdue.

  41. #9591
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    Came across someone who seems to understand the Arctic, and able to write well about it.

    The Recovery of Arctic Sea Ice Extent – Greg Laden's Blog

    During the northern Winter, much of the Arctic is covered with sea ice. Some of this ice melts during the summer, then it regrows. Over recent years, the amount of ice loss in the summer has tended to increase, almost every year, year after year. In 2012 the loss of sea ice was extreme, falling for much of the melting and re-freezing cycle below any year seen before.

    The year 2013 was also extreme, with more ice melting away in the summer than almost every previous year, but not to the extent seen in 2012.
    Climate science denialist used this fact to make up a story. In this case, the word “story” is a nice way of saying “lie.” The denialists claimed that Arctic Sea Ice was “recovering.” Well, it was, sort of. Sea ice in 2013 was more extensive than the previous year, but still at a very low level. Part of the “recovery” story was the assertion that the sea ice would not return to “normal” levels year after year. A cycle was simply repeating itself.

    The problem with the cycle idea is that there is no really a cycle. In a non-global-warming world there probably would be something that looks like a cycle, or at least a decadal (or something) fluctuation from year to year. But with global warming we have seen a phenomenon called “Arctic Amplification.” This is the warming of the arctic region to a greater extent than most of the rest of the plant. With Arctic Amplification we have seen sea ice extent drop nearly every year for about 20 years. I’ve written about the importance of this here. This does not seem to be a cycle, but rather, a downward trend. The fact that 2012 was extreme makes 2013 look like a reversal, but there is no reason to think that it is.

    Now it is Winter in the Arctic. When we look at sea ice extent, we see something interesting. The current level of sea ice is hugging the 98th percentile of observed sea ice extent, at the lower margin. More interestingly, when we compare 2012, the “recovery” year, with the current ice extent, it turns out that the current ice extent is less than the “recovery.”
    More on the link.

    woodbe.

  42. #9592
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Rubbish, still waiting for a detailed rebuttal of any of the third party claims I posted. Also about any of my own claims.

    You'll be waiting quite some time...there no way I am going to risk my mental health by doing anything more than skimming that bogus piffle and giggling sadly. It's waffle like that that contributes to the ongoing retardation of my faith in humanity in the first place...

    Besides...I have a climate adaption plan to prepare...
    Joined RF in 2006...Resigned in 2020.

  43. #9593
    4K Club Member Marc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodbe View Post
    Oh yes, wind farms are unreliable. So how on earth did they supply 41% of the SA electricity in one quarter?

    Because they are not the only component of electricity supply, they are still an infant power source but they are showing their value. SA is on track to have 50% alternate energy supply by 2020 or before. Wind, Geothermal and Solar.

    We have a way to go, Denmark wind power is already at 30% annual demand and growing. SA is about 25% and also growing.



    Wait until offshore wind gets going in SA and we get serious about geothermal and concentrated solar.

    While the shock jocks are whining with fringe issues, the world passes them by, except for the occasional libel case that sends them or their rat nests broke.


    woodbe.
    I wonder if there is a relation between number of people on welfare and windmills. Actually I see a clear relation ... may be cause and effect? Just like CO2 and temperature.
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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  44. #9594
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    It is sad to see how eco-terrorism, left ideology and sheer ignorance keep on pushing "renewables" that are supposed to solve CO2 emissions that cause an imaginary harm to a non existing problem.

    But there is no way to reason with religious belief and political convictions that are part of people's own personality.
    Yet when this evil industry steels from people's assets, and harms their health you would think that it would make some reconsider. Not so, their huge pride and significant ego is in the way of even this basic human character, being sympathetic to other's suffering.
    Imagine for a minute that an oil company behaves in a similar fashion. Boy oh boy would the demented green mass go off their handle. Very sad indeed.

    STOP THESE THINGSTHE TRUTH ABOUT WIND FARMS IN AUSTRALIA










    You are here: Home / Australia / Tony Edney – Bush Lawyer & Poet
    Tony Edney – Bush Lawyer & Poet

    December 5, 2013 by stopthesethings 4 Comments
    Henry Lawson – Australian Bard.
    Australia has a fine tradition of producing “bush” poets.
    In days gone by, men like Banjo Paterson and Henry Lawson wrote about us in voices that were cracked and dry, with swirling dust and sticky flies.
    In modern times, we’ve produced lyrical yarn tellers like Murray Hartin.
    Murray Hartin – wit and wordsmith.
    At the wind power fraud rally, Murray made – with fine words in tune – the 400 or so – that trekked from far and wide to Canberra – both laugh and cry – on a great day in June.
    Tony Edney – Victorian Country Solicitor – joins Murray as not only a man who can handle timbre and verse, but one who knows what happened to make our great Country worse.
    TO A LOST COUNTRYOh, ye savages of men [and women],
    Grasping remnants of the white marauders,
    Who seized this land from the poor blacks,
    With hearts hardened to the tribesmens’ cry,
    And your hearts to the cries of the land itself, to be and remain as it ever has been,Driven by greed to procure unearned wealth,
    You will encumber your birth right with a forest of steel,
    Ruining for ever its ancient profile,
    The skies blanked out with evil metal crosses, that dance and glitter,
    In mechanical insult to nature so cruelly displaced.What greater purpose can mask your avarice?
    To save the country?
    Such hypocrites, who but scoundrels would invoke such a plea?
    Patriotism, always being the last refuge of exploiters,
    Who abuse and despoil for personal gain.A power station, no less, on a huge scale, square miles engulfed,
    Wires stringing across the grassland, spinning towers away to the horizon,
    Birds, bats once passed freely through these skies,
    Now in fog and cloud, at night, they enter a chopping zone,
    Whoomph, whoomph, dashed to the ground, life extinct.This land is not yours to do with as you wish,
    You will be called to account for your destructive ways,
    Look to the future and the legacy of ruin you will leave behind,
    Wreckers of landscapes! The blighted outlooks, a sad mess of wasteland,
    Now almost bereft of wildlife.Leave and live your new lives of luxury,
    Brought with the cost of a countryside,
    Now lost to those who took joy from its silence and beauty,
    Let the neighbours look forever upon your legacy,
    But live fast for surely regret will fall upon you as profoundly as the land has been altered,
    For you have made a mistake that will haunt you and generations to follow.*******
    Tony EdneyTony is the handsome bloke on the right.
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    Related
    Rally - Murray Hartin
    In "Alan Jones"

    The Rally: Details of the Big Day – Tuesday, 18 June 2013
    In "Australia"

    Angus Taylor aka “The Enforcer”
    In "Australia"




    Filed Under: Australia, I've got wind Tagged With: hosts, poetry, Tony Edney, wind power fraud, Wind power fraud rally

    « Mary Morris – On the Warpath
    Illusions not Visions »

    About stopthesethings
    We are a group of citizens concerned about the rapid spread of industrial wind power generation installations across Australia.

    Comments


    • 1957chev says:
      December 6, 2013 at 12:07 am

      History will not be kind, to the wind weasels, and their enablers!

      Reply
    • pmm232 says:
      December 5, 2013 at 10:04 pm

      It is amazing how we see our landscape.
      Beautiful, untouched by man.
      Yes MAN – greed, dig big holes in our land, take over farmland, build houses.
      Of course Industry spreads and creates more Monsters that make noise that drives people nuts – loud noise, easily heard, then low frequency noise that makes us sick.
      Low Frequency Noise and Electromagnetic Radiation.
      Yes Industry does this and Wind Farms all making us sick and the Greed pays the Powers to be, that lets them do this to us.
      When will there be PEACE instead of GREED?

      Reply
    • Colleen Watts says:
      December 5, 2013 at 8:58 pm

      Wonderful! What a pity your obvious and not inconsiderable talents must be spent expressing this outrage.

      Reply
    • Martin Hayles says:
      December 5, 2013 at 7:57 pm

      Tony, You have so succinctly put, that which I struggle to express without a burning rage and an anger unsurpassed.
      Unfortunately, from my experience living on our farm at Curramulka and surrounded by once friendly neighbours who have morphed into opportunistic, parasitic, signed-up turbine hosts, I despair that integrity and morality does not feature in their lexicon. The realisation that this is the case leaves a sadness that will remain in some form whether turbines are built or not.

      Reply


    Leave a Reply







    Fear is the foundation of most government.
    John Adams

  45. #9595
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    If ones aim was to show that those opposed to windfarms are moronic nobodies totally disinterested in logic, reason or intelligent discussion then the last couple of posts couldn't have done better. congratulations Marc for seeing the light and changing sides, who would have thunk it ay! keep up the good work i'm sure your ability to show the depths of human delusion and stupidity will contine to the amusement of the rest of us.

  46. #9596
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodbe View Post
    Well, tell me what you're smoking.

    woodbe.
    Don't worry even the IPCC is even weaning themselves off their euphoric substance of choice, you only now have to come down now.
    regards inter

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    Isn't it amazing that the globes hottest ever recorded temperature was experienced over 100 years ago
    and hasn't been reached since.
    regards inter

  48. #9598
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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Isn't it amazing that the globes hottest ever recorded temperature was experienced over 100 years ago
    and hasn't been reached since.
    regards inter
    No, I wouldn't call that amazing...

  49. #9599
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    Quote Originally Posted by andy the pm View Post
    No, I wouldn't call that amazing...
    yes your right, what would be amazing is the explanation of why it isn't.
    regards inter

  50. #9600
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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    yes your right, what would be amazing is the explanation of why it isn't.
    regards inter
    How about an explanation of why you think it is, after all you posted it...

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