Emission Trading and climate change

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  1. #11701
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Wow look at this baby! I can see this puffing away in my backyard oh yeeess!
    Have to check the best source of coal. Newcastle probably a good choice. Cheap electricity here I come!
    Even nuclear uses a steam boiler process not unlike this one, and so could solar thermal or geothermal. Your point is?
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    The thing is as you fellows have said, CO2 isn't a major contributor to global warming, isn't going to cause catastrophic global warming & MAY effect our standard of living ( that old cherry of propaganda! ), so one would wonder what the who har is all about?
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    The thing is as you fellows have said, CO2 isn't a major contributor to global warming, isn't going to cause catastrophic global warming & MAY effect our standard of living ( that old cherry of propaganda! ), so one would wonder what the who har is all about?
    regards inter
    Which fellows said that? Oh, that's right, not climate scientists, but virtuoso cherry pickers of the irrelevant...

    CO2 is THE major contributor to the Earth's current energy imbalance, which is causing surface warming at an unprecedented rate. That is what the who har is all about, in case you were wondering...
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    Which fellows said that? Oh, that's right, not climate scientists, but virtuoso cherry pickers of the irrelevant...
    ah! Your very close online comrades on this very debate! So nice of you to describe them so appropriately!

    CO2 is THE major contributor to the Earth's current energy imbalance, which is causing surface warming at an unprecedented rate. That is what the who har is all about, in case you were wondering.

    ah the major contributor that's being having a holiday since 1998 despite more than 30% of emissions occurring since this date, the energy imbalance you have when you don't have an imbalance!
    Regards inter

  5. #11705
    4K Club Member Marc's Avatar
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    Global warming is nothing more than an expensive con

    THE concept of manmade global warming has become one of the most powerful ideologies of our age. Dressed up as concern for the planet's future, this rigid orthodoxy has been used by politicians to expand their power and bully the public.

    http://www.express.co.uk/comment/columnists/leo-mckinstry/370670/Global-warming-is-nothing-more-than-an-expensive-con
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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    ah the major contributor that's being having a holiday since 1998 despite more than 30% of emissions occurring since this date
    What holiday since 1998? Global heat content is tracking CO2 emissions since 1998. Who wudda thort?

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  7. #11707
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Global warming is nothing more than an expensive con
    Thanks for the reference to an article by Leo McKinstry. Wondering who he is? Leo McKinstry - journalisted.com
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    What holiday since 1998? Global heat content is tracking CO2 emissions since 1998. Who wudda thort?

    Still peddling the worn out graphs outside the time frame I see! Still not working yet either!
    we liked it better when you were describing your fellow comrades! Now that was nice!
    regards inter

  9. #11709
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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Still peddling the worn out graphs outside the time frame I see! Still not working yet either!
    we liked it better when you were describing your fellow comrades! Now that was nice!
    regards inter
    Simple question for you, intertd6. Since it covers 1960 to 2010, how is the graphic is outside of the relevant time frame?
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  10. #11710
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    I still would like to know how the welfare state of SA is supposed to run 40% on renewables when the average of the whole country is 3%.
    Usually political convictions do show the world in different colours, be it red green brown or blue, but hei ... from 3% to 40% ? Only religious belief plays those tricks on people's mind.

    As far as "What's my point" John, it was not steam.
    Still, not a bad idea to run a generator on biomass and claim some subsidies whilst it lasts, Could run it on all those fruits and vegetables that go to waste because of imports. Could have run it on cattle when our dear Julia busted the live cattle export. (Missed that one I'm afraid) And it would be oh so greeeen
    Piti all those little people who need to eat for a living. Oh well who cares, I have my cafe latte and a bong at home.
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  11. #11711
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    http://joannenova.com.au/2013/12/skeptical-view-makes-australian-front-page-climate-madness-dishonesty-fraud-deception-lies-and-exploition-says-maurice-newman/
    “Why are taxpayers promoting for-profit enterprises?

    “From the UN down, the climate change delusion is a gigantic money tree. It is a tyranny that, despite its pretensions, favours the rich and politically powerful at the expense of the poor and powerless. But the madness of the crowds is waning and, as Mackay writes of the perpetrators: “Punishment is sure to overtake them sooner or later.” We can only hope it comes before most of us descend into serfdom.

    .................................................. ......................
    http://northerntruthseeker.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/the-global-warming-fraud-here-is-great.html
    "Runaway Global Warming promises to literally burn-up agricultural areas into dust worldwide by 2012, causing global famine, anarchy, diseases, and war on a global scale as military powers including the U.S., Russia, and China, fight for control of the Earth's remaining resources.

    Over 4.5 billion people could die from Global Warming related causes by 2012, as planet Earth accelarates into a greed-driven horrific catastrophe. "

    Well, readers, it is now 2014, some two years since "4.5 billion people" were to have died from "Global Warming related" causes, and we are all still here....The only people who may have died from "climate change" have been those who have FROZEN to death due to the intense cold we have experienced over the last few winters....
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    Simple question for you, intertd6. Since it covers 1960 to 2010, how is the graphic is outside of the relevant time frame?
    The answer is the same as the last 20, 30, 50 times you have tried the same type of rubbish, Maybe we are the subjects of some sort of weird psychological self flagellation demonstration needed to join a special group?
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    The only people who may have died from "climate change" have been those who have FROZEN to death due to the intense cold we have experienced over the last few winters....
    There aren't many of those during the current record global surface temperature...

    The combined global land and ocean average surface temperature for the January–July period (year-to-date) was 0.66°C (1.19°F) above the 20th century average of 13.8°C (56.9°F), tying with 2002 as the third warmest such period on record.

    Global Analysis - July 2014 | State of the Climate | National Climatic Data Center (NCDC)
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    Simple question for you, intertd6. Since it covers 1960 to 2010, how is the graphic is outside of the relevant time frame?
    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    The answer is the same as the last 20, 30, 50 times you have tried the same type of rubbish, Maybe we are the subjects of some sort of weird psychological self flagellation demonstration needed to join a special group?
    So that's a "No", you can't answer a simple question.
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    So that's a "No", you can't answer a simple question.
    Is the latest demonstration over now?
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Is the latest demonstration over now?
    regards inter
    Is that a simple question?
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    Is that a simple question?
    You seem to like answering questions for other people! You tell me?
    regards inter

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    Default Re: Emission Trading

    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    You seem to like answering questions for other people! You tell me?
    regards inter
    In that case, no.
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    Default Re: Emission Trading

    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Very light reading indeed...
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    There is no reproducible scientific evidence CO2 has significantly increased in the last 100 years. Anecdotal evidence doesn’t mean anything in science, it’s not significant…”
    Read more at NASA Scientist: Global Warming Is Nonsense

    Is this a misprint? Nobody could believe that, could they?

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    [QUOTE]Dr. Leslie Woodcock, emeritus professor at the University of Manchester (UK) School of Chemical Engineering and Analytical Science, is a former NASA scientist along with other impressive accomplishments on his distinguished professional resume.In an interview, he laughed off man-made climate change as nonsense and a money-making industry for the green lobby, which approaches the subject with a religious fervor. Explained Woodcock:
    “The term ‘climate change’ is meaningless. The Earth’s climate has been changing since time immemorial, that is since the Earth was formed 1,000 million years ago. The theory of ‘man-made climate change’ is an unsubstantiated hypothesis

    Read more at NASA Scientist: Global Warming Is Nonsense
    /QUOTE]
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    Dr. Leslie Woodcock, emeritus professor at the University of Manchester (UK) School of Chemical Engineering and Analytical Science, is a former NASA scientist along with other impressive accomplishments on his distinguished professional resume.In an interview, he laughed off man-made climate change as nonsense and a money-making industry for the green lobby, which approaches the subject with a religious fervor. Explained Woodcock:
    “The term ‘climate change’ is meaningless. The Earth’s climate has been changing since time immemorial, that is since the Earth was formed 1,000 million years ago. The theory of ‘man-made climate change’ is an unsubstantiated hypothesis

    Read more at NASA Scientist: Global Warming Is Nonsense
    So why are most scientist who are vocal against the global warming fraud retired?
    Does not require a detective mind to understand that if you want to keep employed you don't go against the moves that bring the bacon in. If you want to pay off your mortgage, you don't tell the media that your employer is a mercenary sold out to those who pay for the grants. If you want to keep your reputation intact, you don't tell the opposition that they are right and the guy at the top is just mouthing what brings the marginal's vote in. If you want to keep your job, you don't tell the boss that earth hour is a political statement and should not be promoted at work.... well I actually did that and confronted the CEO where I work with exactly those words and earth hour is no longer sprooked via work email. Sometimes you are just lucky.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    Very light reading indeed...
    any lightweight would agree, the really interesting parts of this story are the responces below the article.
    regards inter

  25. #11725
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    [QUOTE=Marc;945435]So why are most scientist who are vocal against the global warming fraud retired?/QUOTE]

    In the case of L.V.Woodcock it is because he is past retirement age and has lost his faculty. No conspiracy theory needed.
    Before you speak, ask yourself: Is it necessary, it is true, does it improve on the silence? - Baba

  26. #11726
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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    any lightweight would agree, the really interesting parts of this story are the responces below the article.
    To get to the responses requires ignoring the misinformation at the top of the article.

    Emeritus Professor Leslie V Woodcock is not and was never a NASA scientist. Nor is he a professor, he is an emeritus professor (different thing). In the past when he was a professor, he was not a "top" professor going by the lack of citations of his work in Google Scholar and other professional citation indices.

    Oh, and what is Woodcock doing now? Teaching a short university course on the importance of "Monte Carlo Method" computer simulations in scientific research - the very same method that has been pooh-poohed as producing results that are nonsense by climate change contrarians.
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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    any lightweight would agree, the really interesting parts of this story are the responces below the article.
    The views of the Peanut Gallery on any such story on any such website long ago ceased to be interesting...beyond the never ending amazement provided at the breadth and depth of the human condition. Given the choice, I prefer the more condensed environment of this thread...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    So why are most scientist who are vocal against the global warming fraud retired?
    Does not require a detective mind to understand that if you want to keep employed you don't go against the moves that bring the bacon in.
    Alternatively...does not require a detective mind to understand that if you are unemployed or retired on an former academics income/superannuation then you make whatever moves that continue to bring the bacon in so you can maintain the lifestyle you've become accustomed to.

    To be honest though...they are as human and contrarian as the rest of us. It's no wonder there's a few outliers on show...
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    To get to the responses requires ignoring the misinformation at the top of the article.

    Emeritus Professor Leslie V Woodcock is not and was never a NASA scientist. Nor is he a professor, he is an emeritus professor (different thing). In the past when he was a professor, he was not a "top" professor going by the lack of citations of his work in Google Scholar and other professional scitation indices.

    Oh, and what is Woodcock doing now? Teaching a short university course on the importance of "Monte Carlo Method" computer simulations in scientific research - the very same method that has been pooh-poohed as producing results that are nonsense by climate change contrarians.

    LOL as expected right on cue, attack the person and not the points made. Good work John. Most people are so over this tactic, it becomes just a joke now to be laughed off.

    Destroys credibility for sure. But who's credibility does it destroy?? I guess that depends where your "beliefs" lie now doesn't it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    The views of the Peanut Gallery on any such story on any such website long ago ceased to be interesting...beyond the never ending amazement provided at the breadth and depth of the human condition.
    I follow up on every link. You never know when doing so might turn up something that shakes the foundations of my understanding of things, but so far it's been just bone-shaking hilarious puff...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    LOL as expected right on cue, attack the person and not the points made. Good work John.
    Read again Rod. Talk about right on cue you are wrong again. I didn't attack Woodcock - I attacked the false claims made by a third party in an attempt to bolster the third party's ideological position.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    But who's credibility does it destroy?? I guess that depends where your "beliefs" lie now doesn't it.
    To any rational person, it destroys the credibility of the person telling the porky pies, in this case "reporter" Neil Hudson.
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  32. #11732
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rod Dyson View Post
    LOL as expected right on cue, attack the person and not the points made. Good work John. Most people are so over this tactic, it becomes just a joke now to be laughed off.

    Destroys credibility for sure. But who's credibility does it destroy?? I guess that depends where your "beliefs" lie now doesn't it.
    I did post a link to an article where Prof Woodcock states that CO2 has not increased in 100 years. Do you accept that as true?

  33. #11733
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    The Claim: 50 million climate refugees will be produced by climate change by the year 2010. Especially hard hit will be river delta areas, and low lying islands in the Caribbean and Pacific. The UN 62nd General assembly in July 2008 said: …it had been estimated that there would be between 50 million and 200 million environmental migrants by 2010.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    The UN 62nd General assembly in July 2008 said:
    Er, no that wasn't a statement issued by the UN General Assembly. A speaker named Srgjan Kerim made that statement when addressing at the 62nd General Assembly.

    Tony Abbott said ""We are very confident that we know the position of the MH370 black box flight recorder to within some kilometres." He was only out by a few thousand kilometres, and it was contrary to the advice given to him from the navy undertaking the search. Now Australia has committed another $100 million to find someone else's plane that isn't in our waters. And you think climate scientists are scamming government funds - LOL.
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  35. #11735
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    Default Re: Emission Trading

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    The Claim: 50 million climate refugees will be produced by climate change by the year 2010. Especially hard hit will be river delta areas, and low lying islands in the Caribbean and Pacific. The UN 62nd General assembly in July 2008 said: …it had been estimated that there would be between 50 million and 200 million environmental migrants by 2010.
    It's easy to be smug with hindsight...and yet few of those areas have been spared from facing some real challenges. Check out the issues facing the Sacramento River Delta for example...just one tiny example.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    It's easy to be smug with hindsight...and yet few of those areas have been spared from facing some real challenges.
    Of course one of the big reasons the disasters haven't yet come to pass is that people acted on the alarm bells tolling - once the risks were highlighted, and national, international government agencies and NGOs have swung into action to mitigate the affects of climate change and assist with adaption. Organisations like IRRI who have developed drought tolerant rice for 23 million hectares of affected area in SE Asia and India, and acid sulphate soil tolerant rice for areas of the Mekong Delta suffering from seawater inundation as far inland as 100 kilometres from the coast. IRRI - Rice science for a better world.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    I still would like to know how the welfare state of SA is supposed to run 40% on renewables when the average of the whole country is 3%.
    Adelaide rates as the fifth best city in the world to live in ahead of Sydney. Adelaide's not such a bad place to live in since renewable policies ensure that all those horrid welfare recipients are mixed onto the concrete bases for the wind generator towers, thus reducing welfare energy consumption and making it easier to reach the target of generating 40% by wind. Oh, and the welfare state always has visiting federal LNC politicians to give their speeches in front of a wind farm - all that puff and hot air boosts output significantly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Oh well who cares, I have my cafe latte and a bong at home.
    Really? Who would have thought! Your posts are always so lucid and well thought out. I thought the Aldous Huxley signature was an a curious "do as I say, not as I do" moment - never connected it to drug driven theorisation inspired by "the man who gave drug driven Utopias a bad name..."
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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    Adelaide rates as the fifth best city in the world to live in ahead of Sydney. Adelaide's not such a bad place to live in since renewable policies ensure that all those horrid welfare recipients are mixed onto the concrete bases for the wind generator towers, thus reducing welfare energy consumption and making it easier to reach the target of generating 40% by wind. Oh, and the welfare state always has visiting federal LNC politicians to give their speeches in front of a wind farm - all that puff and hot air boosts output significantly.



    Really? Who would have thought! Your posts are always so lucid and well thought out. I thought the Aldous Huxley signature was an a curious "do as I say, not as I do" moment - never connected it to drug driven theorisation inspired by "the man who gave drug driven Utopias a bad name..."
    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
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    .

  39. #11739
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    There are websites dedicated to post false and unfulfilled "prophecies" from the priests of the global warming confession, there are HUNDREDS of crappy, ridiculous, impossible, farcical, absurd, facetious and comical "predictions" pontificated as fact at the time that in time did not even come close to reality. THis is one of them. And no this is not "hindsight" it is called testing the prophet. When you rub your crystal ball and pretend to know the future based on bad data, all I need to do is wait, and then read the bull$hit again, and see that it is @rap from mercenaries who live off the taxpayer selling to the emperor air clothes and telling him they are oh so real and if you can't see them you must be a denier.

    Oh and John2bee, so the sea did not rise because we acted so quickly that all those disasters were averted? DO you seriously believe that? A lie of that magnitude can not be sold not even to the Baron of Munchausen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentButDeadly View Post
    The views of the Peanut Gallery on any such story on any such website long ago ceased to be interesting...beyond the never ending amazement provided at the breadth and depth of the human condition. Given the choice, I prefer the more condensed environment of this thread...
    that is the common view of someone with their head planted where the sun doesn't shine, if you don't understand the information contained in the trailing comments or realise that they maybe the work of a very learned person in physics, then get someone to explain it for you! Information of value can come from any source anytime!
    Regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neptune View Post
    .
    Thank you Neptune. Duly noted and I agree it was a weak willed parody because I was sick of the tirade of digs against people not liked by another participant. I am sorry if you or anyone else was affronted.

    It is a pity that you could make the same observation of a great number of the posts by a number of participants in this thread. I wonder why you chose mine? Surely you have something better to contribute than attacking me in this thread? It seems to be coming a bit of an obsession - have you improved on the silence? Perhaps you have by drawing an apology from me...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Oh and John2bee, so the sea did not rise because we acted so quickly that all those disasters were averted? DO you seriously believe that?
    Of course I don't believe that mankind averted sea rise by quick action and nor did I suggest that I might believe it. Perhaps you should re-read my post.

    Basically what I said was that actions by many governmental and non-governmental organisations in response to the alarms raised have gone a long way to mitigating the disaster of a "nothing's wrong, so do nothing" approach, and that is what has prevented the great number of climate refugees that would have otherwise resulted.

    Sea rise has outstripped predictions BTW. When I was in My Tho in the heart of the Mekong Delta in 2011, at high tide the water was above the gutters covering the footpaths. My Tho is 50 km inland, yet sea water is inundating the land and poisoning it, land where people have lived and farmed for thousands of years. The Mekong Delta produces 50% of Vietnam's rice crop. http://irri.org/networks/climate-cha...e-mekong-delta
    Before you speak, ask yourself: Is it necessary, it is true, does it improve on the silence? - Baba

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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    To get to the responses requires ignoring the misinformation at the top of the article.

    Emeritus Professor Leslie V Woodcock is not and was never a NASA scientist. Nor is he a professor, he is an emeritus professor (different thing). In the past when he was a professor, he was not a "top" professor going by the lack of citations of his work in Google Scholar and other professional citation indices.

    So tell us that the dear professor has never had an association with NASA? The rest of your paragraph looks like it's just nitpicking garbage of a frustrated tugger!

    Oh, and what is Woodcock doing now? Teaching a short university course on the importance of "Monte Carlo Method" computer simulations in scientific research - the very same method that has been pooh-poohed as producing results that are nonsense by climate change contrarians

    Who cares?

    .
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    he rest of your paragraph looks like it's just nitpicking garbage of a frustrated tugger!
    I do not know if the reasons Neil Hudson needs to make stuff up to bolster his ideological position is because he is a frustrated whatever or not. But make it up, he does.

    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Who cares?
    People who want to know the truth care, and people who don't want to know the truth don't care.
    Before you speak, ask yourself: Is it necessary, it is true, does it improve on the silence? - Baba

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    Calling someone a frustrated tugger is setting new lows, that level of depravity should not be acceptable on a public forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post
    Of course I don't believe that mankind averted sea rise by quick action and nor did I suggest that I might believe it. Perhaps you should re-read my post.

    Basically what I said was that actions by many governmental and non-governmental organisations in response to the alarms raised have gone a long way to mitigating the disaster of a "nothing's wrong, so do nothing" approach, and that is what has prevented the great number of climate refugees that would have otherwise resulted.

    Sea rise has outstripped predictions BTW. When I was in My Tho in the heart of the Mekong Delta in 2011, at high tide the water was above the gutters covering the footpaths. My Tho is 50 km inland, yet sea water is inundating the land and poisoning it, land where people have lived and farmed for thousands of years. The Mekong Delta produces 50% of Vietnam's rice crop. IRRI - Climate change affecting land use in the Mekong Delta
    Oh dear another AGW alarmist cr*p story! If you knew even the slightest about the garbage you parrot you would know that the mekon delta is in danger of sinking below sea level because of ground water removal for human use, it is subsiding around 23mm per year & has subsided around 30cm to 70cm over the last 20 years!

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    Calling someone a frustrated tugger is setting new lows, that level of depravity should not be acceptable on a public forum.
    I didn't call anybody that! As usual you need to read & understand things a bit better!
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by John2b View Post


    People who want to know the truth care, and people who don't want to know the truth don't care.
    he could be crocheting lace doilies now for all I care, he has some public documented respected credentials, what do you have?
    regards inter

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    Oh dear another AGW alarmist cr*p story! If you knew even the slightest about the garbage you parrot you would know that the mekon delta is in danger of sinking below sea level because of ground water removal for human use, it is subsiding around 6mm per year! DADS!
    Thanks Inter for succinctly illuminating the issue of subsidence in the Mekong, which I did not know about. The subsidence is being compounded by sea level rise running at an average of 3mm per year around the Mekong. Subsidence can be stopped or even reversed by stopping the ground water extraction. On the other hand, sea level rise as a consequence of human emissions of CO2 can not be stopped in any meaningful timeframe.
    Before you speak, ask yourself: Is it necessary, it is true, does it improve on the silence? - Baba

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    Quote Originally Posted by intertd6 View Post
    he has some public documented respected credentials, what do you have?
    What would you know? It isn't for me to claim authority and I don't anyway. The stuff I post is mostly referenced so you can check it for yourself. And if it is obviously made up stuff, you can point that out, like I do, with reasons why, like I do. It probably never requires denigrating someone to prove a point...
    Before you speak, ask yourself: Is it necessary, it is true, does it improve on the silence? - Baba

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