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  1. #1
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    Default Free Insulation

    http://pm.gov.au/media/Release/2009/...lease_0783.cfm

    ENERGY EFFICIENT HOMES - CEILING INSULATION IN 2.7 MILLION HOMES
    03 February 2009

    To support jobs and set Australia up for a low carbon future the Rudd Government will install free ceiling insulation in around 2.7 million Australian homes.

    This investment will support the jobs of tradespeople and workers employed in the manufacturing, distribution and installation of ceiling insulation during a severe global recession.

    In addition, under the Energy Efficient Homes investment the Solar Hot Water Rebate will be increased from $1000 to $1600 from today and the Low Emissions Plan for Renters rebate will increase from $500 to $1000.

    The Energy Efficient Homes investment will:

    Install ceiling insulation in around 2.7 million Australian homes;
    Cut around $200 per year off the energy bills for households benefiting from these ceiling insulation programs;
    Reduce greenhouse gas emissions by around 49.4 million tonnes by 2020, the equivalent of taking more than 1 million cars off the road.
    Energy Efficient Homes is a key element of the Government’s $42 billion Nation Building and Jobs Plan to support up to 90,000 Australian jobs over the next two years.


    2.7 million Energy Efficient Homes

    Insulation is typically the most cost effective way to improve a home’s energy efficiency. Although all newly-built homes must be insulated, many older homes – up to 40 per cent of Australia’s housing stock – remain uninsulated.

    This results in many householders paying much more than they need to in energy bills.

    Once installed, households could save around $200 per year on their energy bills, as well as improve the comfort and value of their homes.

    The Energy Efficient Homes package will modernise Australia’s homes, it will enable almost all Australian homes to be operating at a minimum two star energy rating by 2011.

    For a time-limited period of two and a half years, from 1 July 2009, owner-occupiers without ceiling insulation will be eligible for free product and installation (capped at $1,600) simply by making a phone call.

    As an interim arrangement, from today and until 30 June 2009, eligible owner-occupiers who install ceiling insulation in their homes will be able to seek reimbursement (up to $1,600) after the program commences. The Government estimates 2.2 million owner-occupied home will benefit from this program.

    Many of Australia’s most vulnerable households are renters, who do not own their own home. To help these households lower their emissions and save money on energy bills, the Government will also double the rebate available under the Low Emissions Plan for Renters for landlords to install insulation in their rental properties – from $500 to up to $1,000 – from today until 30 June 2011. The Government estimates 500,000 rented homes will benefit from this program.

    The Energy Efficient Homes investment also increases the Government’s Solar Hot Water Rebate from $1,000 to $1,600 from today until 30 June 2012. This rebate will not be means-tested.

    Under this Energy Efficient Homes package, homeowners will be able to access either the insulation program or the solar hot water rebate.

    These investments will ensure that the maximum number of Australians – both homeowners and renters – will have access to practical measures that help them to reduce their energy use and save on energy bills prior to the introduction of the Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme.

    As well as supporting jobs during a severe global recession the Energy Efficient Homes investment delivers on the Government’s commitments in the Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme White Paper to ensure all households receive support to take practical action to reduce energy use and save on energy bills.

  2. #2
    Old Chippy 6K
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    A good idea and a good investment that will provide long lasting benefits. As installation can be done by pretty much any fit person with only a little training a good employment possibly. Sadly the flaw will likely be how they implement it - most govt programs have admin overheads of 40% or more!

  3. #3
    Golden Member GraemeCook's Avatar
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    Lets wait for the fine print


    Cheers

    Graeme

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    Here is the fine print: http://www.environment.gov.au/energy...nsulation.html

    We'll just have to see if gets through parliament.

  5. #5
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    Looking forward to this. Now Bloss won't have to help me install it lol

  6. #6
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    What about all the people with insulation installed 30 years ago that is totally ineffective and probably doesnt have any R value remaining???

  7. #7
    Slow but rough Uncle Bob's Avatar
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    They dip out. Though I suppose if they could remove it then they may have a chance.

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    This sounds good. I wonder if you can talk the installer around putting extra insulation on your existing insulation. Possibly bring the R value upto 7 or so. Do you think it would be any skin off their nose to do this? Its still work for them surely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tricky4000 View Post
    This sounds good. I wonder if you can talk the installer around putting extra insulation on your existing insulation. Possibly bring the R value upto 7 or so. Do you think it would be any skin off their nose to do this? Its still work for them surely.
    Part of the program is that the approved installers work will be randomly audited. They could roll the dice and do this, but they would be risking the biggest cash cow of their careers.

  10. #10
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    The blurb states the 'average' cost is expected to be about $1200 per house - is that before or after the potential $1600 subsidy? ie, is it expected that an 'average' house can get insulated at no real cost to the owner?

    Also, does the owner pay 'up front' and get reimbursed or, because the beaurocrats are organising the initial assessment and quote by their registered contractors, do they pay the contractor and the homeoner only pays any gap?

    Either way, sounds like its worth getting into..
    If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing

  11. #11
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    Now just sit back and watch the cost rise to meet the new demand. The cost of insulation will double and the good builders and home owners that put insulation in already (with no handouts) will be penalized.

    Work hard and do the right thing, you will get nothing.

    Sit back do nothing and collect the handouts.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundancewfs View Post
    What about all the people with insulation installed 30 years ago that is totally ineffective and probably doesnt have any R value remaining???
    now that is an interesting point, how does one go about checking it though ?

    We have pink batts in the roof (no comment please) that have been there for at least 15 years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastwing View Post
    Now just sit back and watch the cost rise to meet the new demand. The cost of insulation will double and the good builders and home owners that put insulation in already (with no handouts) will be penalized.
    It's already gone up. At my local bunnings the insulation for a R3.5 pack of CSR is $52. It was much cheaper than than a couple of weeks ago. Greedy @@@@ers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrian View Post
    now that is an interesting point, how does one go about checking it though ?
    Like was said they'll run audits. I doubt any installer is going to risk their cash cow that will run for two years to help you out. It just isn't worth it. There will probably be a shortage of installers so there will be more than enough work.

    There is nothing stopping you going up there and removing the existing old insulation and calling them up though. It's probably what I'd be doing if I was in your position. Not exactly tough to climb on the roof and remove the insulation into a garbage bag assuming you are properly geared up (mask, overall, eye protection etc).

    I'm lucky since I don't have any insulation. I was actually going to go with the $300 rebate only (paying the rest myself) and install it myself but since the Federal government is coughing up $1600 and I don't have to touch a thing I'll let them take care of it.

  15. #15
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    Just like the lpg rebate, installation cost doubled overnight

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrian View Post
    now that is an interesting point, how does one go about checking it though ?

    We have pink batts in the roof (no comment please) that have been there for at least 15 years.
    As long as they're installed properly and not being messed about with (water, being walked on etc) then I can't see any reason why the batts wouldn't still be doing their job in another 15 or 150 years time. There's not much to go wrong with them with the non-reflective types.

    I installed various brands of batts (whatever the hardware store had at the time - bought the lot over about a year as finances allowd) at my parents house in 1992. They haven't noticed any reduction in performance since then, and with a fairly small capacity heater it would be very noticeable if the batts stopped insulating.

    Only thing I'm not so happy about is I can't claim the $ to insulate under the floor. I've already got ceiling insulation.

  17. #17
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    Great website,

    The F@@@@Rs have got us nabbed,

    FAQ,

    I already have old insulation in my ceiling, can I access the program to replace this?
    No, the assistance is only available for those homes without ceiling insulation.
    How do you address concerns that insulation will be laid on top of contaminated or old insulation?

    The assistance is only available for those homes without existing ceiling insulation.

    When does it start?

    While the program commences on 1 July 2009, households that install ceiling insulation from the announcement on 3 February 2009, will be able to seek reimbursement up to a maximum amount of $1,600. So, if you have insulation installed between 3 February 2009 and 30 June 2009, keep your receipts.

    Please register online so that we can notify you of program details as soon as they become available. Guidelines will be available on this website, or by calling our Hotline on 1800 808 571 by the 26 February 2009.<?p> PLEASE NOTE: To qualify for the assistance, the insulation must be installed by an installer who owns or is employed by a registered business operating in the installation of thermal insulation.

  18. #18
    2K Club Member barney118's Avatar
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    So take out that stuff in your ceiling put it under your floor. I have been done part of my own, bag lot here and there (still need to do the kitchen but need to rip off ceiling and put new one up), I havent put my claim in with NSW to claim $300 back since I lost a reciept for 5 bags of the stuff.

    Having spent $1k on building blanket, $700 on batts to get my 1.5R (1.8 effective) + 3.5 R rating to meet the stds, I think I might have to take em out and put them under the floor and make a phone call.

  19. #19
    Slow but rough Uncle Bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barney118 View Post
    I might have to take em out and put them under the floor and make a phone call.
    That's the way lol.

  20. #20
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    And Wayne Swan wont say how much of it will be coming in from overseas.....that'll help the deficit
    I just love sheepies!

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by barney118 View Post

    FAQ,

    I already have old insulation in my ceiling, can I access the program to replace this?
    No, the assistance is only available for those homes without ceiling insulation.
    How do you address concerns that insulation will be laid on top of contaminated or old insulation?

    The assistance is only available for those homes without existing ceiling insulation.
    This is a great site, and that answer is correct, but for info on this stuff always best to go the the source (already listed above , but here it is again: http://www.environment.gov.au/energy...ncy/index.html

    In any case unless you are a rare case that has blown in asbestos insulation the notion of 'contaminated or old insulation' is simply misplaced. There are a few exceptions (not many), but in most cases any upgrade of insulation can go directly over any old insulation - there is no need to remove the old and a number of benefits in leaving it in place. The main 'contaminant' will simply be dust - and any new insulation will quickly get enough of that on it too. Leaving the old in place will increase the average R-value even if it was unevenly spread blown in insulation. A search on this site will give plenty of information on insulating your house - even a look at posts by me will throw up quite a few.

    Also worth looking at this one too: http://www.yourhome.gov.au/technical/fs47.html

  22. #22
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    My partner and I just brought our first home together.

    It was built in the 1950's and does not have any insulation at all.

    We get pretty cold during the night and cant wait to get the insulation fixed.

    What is the phone number to call to get this "FREE" insulation?

    Cheers

    Mick

  23. #23
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    What is the phone number to call to get this "FREE" insulation?

    Head to this website: http://apps.nowwhere.com.au/dewha/in...h/default.aspx and look for an installer near you. They'll come and give you a quote, if you go ahead and the quote is under $1600 there will be no cost to you. The installer will do the work and then claim the rebate from the government.

    Interestingly I've had two quotes in the last couple of weeks and one was $1525 and the other $1575, amazing how I'm just under the rebate amount I wonder how much it would have cost last year....

    Cheers,
    Toothman
    Last edited by Toothman; 14th Jul 2009 at 04:58 PM. Reason: Added MixPhotos question

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    Default Save some time

    I have about 8 quotes in the Gold coast area. For a 17 sq home they ranged from $1375 to $2900 for virtually the same rating 2.5-3.0 product.
    Don't have any connection to the succesful tenderer, but if I am allowed to mention them, I can let you know a reputable company who will install it in a home this size for under the rebate (you pay nothing) just sign a form..

    We used Austral Insulation in Queensland and found them to be the cheapest (and the most polite)

  25. #25
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    Default Free insulation !!

    I will re-phrase my removed post... without mentioning any supplier names or ph numbers. If you have a 16-17 sq brick veneer home. DON'T pay any more than the rebate price.(In Queensland)
    I know from experience that the 3.5 rated product can be installed for under this amount. just keep getting quotes until someone wants the job.
    Mine is going in tommorrow for the grand total of $0.00

    enjoy your FREE insulation from Uncle Kev

  26. #26
    2K Club Member seriph1's Avatar
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    here is my experience. An Ad was run in our local paper for free insulation to the value of $1600. I called, spoke to someone and booked a time. two days later the guy visited, got into the roof then measured the house's exterior walls. The quote was about the same ($121 more) as the one I had done two years ago.

    The next day the guy dropped in the forms, which I read and signed. On Friday and Saturday of last week he installed the insulation, but there were issues.

    1 - heating ducts all through the ceiling
    2 - ceiling joists were not 450 or 600 apart, but 520
    3 - the old, existing insulation, which had failed was like a fine dust when it was touched.
    4 - the firm who was meant to supply R3.5 batts to us no longer makes them, so they replaced them all with R4's - a good win that one.

    here is what happened:

    Using a Stanley Blade the installer cut each batt in half (1170 long each) which enabled him to fit them snugly between the joists.

    he used an extra bag and a half in total - no additional charge

    he crushed the existing useless insulation and pushed it to one end so when time permits I can vacuum it out of the roof space.

    he didnt complain about a thing especially the difficulty of getting around the ducting and took all the empty plastic bags with him.

    So that was Friday and Saturday's experience .... We arrived home on Sunday to see him climbing off our roof at the front of the house. He had noticed that three sheets of iron had come adrift and returned with a cordless drill and THE RIGHT COLOUR roofing screws and fixed it. He tried to leave with payment but he left with a bottle of wine and $30.

    We love living in the country

    I imagine there will be all kinds of different experiences people will have with this and I can't say whether it will be good bad or indifferent, but fact-by-fact, this was our experience

    BTW - the people who think (I was one) you can't get new insulation if you already have old, failed stuff in the roof are 100% incorrect. The government website used to indicate that at the start of the program. It was changed to reflect our experience some time ago, with our experience as proof of that change - but I urge each person to find out for themselves..... preferably while signing up for the scheme. And for what it's worth, perhaps the price has gone up a bit for the batts. It is a pig of a job so I reckon fair enough.

    The whole thing cost us $93.70 and our home is a LOT warmer for it.

    We have now bought these funky things called DRAFT-STOPPA's as well and will be fitting them to the exhaust fans in the Bathroom etc. For $40 they stop heat loss/gain and dust through the vents.
    Steve
    Kilmore (Melbourne-ish)
    Australia

    ....catchy phrase here

  27. #27
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    Default Free insulation

    Ours went in at 6:30 am this morning. 2 young guys went in through the man hole. No damage and 2 and a half hours later and the 3.5 (not 2.5) rated batts went in.
    Good on ya Kev... Good old Queensland generosity.. We will probably pay for them some how in Electricity price increases.
    Just my opinion, but when I lived in Melbourne we had the flow in stuff and it ended up in the lights, heater , powerpoints, and over most furniture. So unless it has improved since the 90's go for batts.

  28. #28
    Slow but rough Uncle Bob's Avatar
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    One more to add to the list:

    Spotless - Insulation Installation - Bunnings Warehouse

    Got mine put in yesterday and the place seems warmer already. They took a while to get back to me after filling in the online form (about 3 weeks), though I suppose that's to be expected with the subsidy happening atm.

  29. #29
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    I had crappy insulation before, but now R4 throughout the roof. I noticed the difference the first night. Heater ran half the time it usually did.
    I'm no expert, but know enough to be dangerous...
    __________________

  30. #30
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    We had ours put in on the weekend. They came out on Tuesday and had a look in the roof, measured the size of the house and gave a quote ($1400). I was expecting to hear from them in a week about arranging a time, but got a call the next day wanting to know a time and a day. They were good enough to come on a Saturday which is great as it means i didn't need a day off from work.
    They guys were on time and done in about 2 hours.
    I thought that $1400 was a little much for 11 squares but i don't mind, i'm not paying for it.

  31. #31
    Naf
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    Does anyone know why the rebate has been reduced to $1200? Maybe some of the installers were over quoting. I had someone come around yesterday, gave me a quote of $1491, however the waived the $100 admin fee and also the $100 delivery fee, now I have no problem paying $91 for insulation, but if I hired a tradesman for something, let's say a new hot water service, would the plumber charge me a delivery fee?
    Don't get me wrong, I think this scheme is excellent. Just seems that people are adding extra charges just so they can take them off again to show how good and fair they are. I could be wrong. End of rant.

    Nathan

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naf View Post
    but if I hired a tradesman for something, let's say a new hot water service, would the plumber charge me a delivery fee?
    Picking up materials is factored in to costings, could take him half hour or more to pick up heater from supplier. Average this over the week could be spending 4 hrs plus picking materials up. Don't no many people who would work for half a day for free

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    Just dragging up this old thread as I've just had mine done now too...

    I used the Bunnings Spotless service - logged my details over the phone, and had a guy visit my house approx 2 - 3 weeks later. We booked in a time for the install, and 3 young blokes rocked up on time as arranged. 25 minutes flat and they were finished. They used R4's which I was rapt about.

    About a year ago, I had started installing some insulation myself (at my own expense) - but never got very far due to cash flow - I'd only fitted 2 or 3 bags, so I'd say my roof was only 5% or so done. Glad I held off now after having it all done without outlaying a single dollar. Fantastic offer, I am very happy.

    I did have a quick look at the job afterwards though, and it's certainly a quick-job... the batts are a bit messy and "thrown-in", with a few gaps here and there, but I will neaten them up myself at some point in time.

    PS. My house is very small.... by the time I had it done, the rebate was down to $1200, but still covered the job easily.

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    Default Insulation Installers

    I have had a very good service for insulation install into my house using this company.

    Welcome to Home Green - let's get started!

    The person who came to give the quote was very knowledgeable on the different types of insulation and also gave me some recommendations on how i can make my home more efficient with window shades etc.

    The installers turned up on time and completed the job over 3 hours. They did not fall through the ceiling which was my biggest worry. They also cleaned up after themselves leaving no mess.

    Quality of materials was very good. I was shown this by the installer before i let them put it up in my roof. They even showed me the certification to Australian standards.

    Highly recommended

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    We had ours done in August and the difference it made in Winter was great but the difference it is now making in our house in Summer is truly amazing.
    I wasnt happy with the company in the way they sent one short little Indonesian guy to lug all those batts up a ladder to my 10 ft ceilings by himself. I had to give him a hand or there was no way he would have managed.
    Other than that it has been brilliant, thanks Ruddy!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Colsy View Post
    Other than that it has been brilliant, thanks Ruddy!
    Don't thank Kevin, thank yourself and all of us other tax payers that will be paying for all our new insulation for many many years to come.

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    I have just moved into a new house that is about 15 years old. It seems to have insulation above the ceiling in the form of a thick layer (say 5cm to 10cm) of dust particles.

    No insulation on pitched roof.

    Is the dust particle insulation any good. Is it also preferrable to have insulation on the pitched roof in addition to the ceiling?

    Cheers

  38. #38
    Slow but rough Uncle Bob's Avatar
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    The results are in. After getting Spotless/Bunnings to do the job our power has been halved. I reckon this Government initiative is definitely a winner.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heartbroken View Post

    Is the dust particle insulation any good. Is it also preferrable to have insulation on the pitched roof in addition to the ceiling?

    Cheers
    Dust particles good for dust mites, not much good for humans! Best to vacuum that roof space then put batts on ceiling (or double or triple layer foil types, but they are not so good in winter). Foil under the roof (shiny side faces in or use double faced no blue) as well as batts is best, but retrofitting foil is harder (but I've done my own and a few other places).

    But go get the some of your taxes back with the subsidy before you do the work:

    Australian Government Energy Efficient Homes Package - Ceiling Insulation Rebates - Home Page

    BTW - the reason the amount dropped is that the total amount allocated for the program was fixed and the take up was too fast - same issue arises anytime you give a subsidy to something people want to do anyway (like the roof top PV subsidy!).
    Advice from me on this forum is general and for guidance based on information given by the member posing the question. Not to be used in place of professional advice from people appropriately qualified in the relevant field. All structural work must be approved and constructed to the BCA or other relevant standards by suitably licensed persons. The person doing the work and reading my advice accepts responsibility for ensuring the work done accords with the applicable law.

  40. #40
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    We have a 1950s weatherboard in Melbourne that DOES have existing pink-bat insulation, but its pretty ancient, full of soot (black) compacted quite far down in places.
    thickness varies from around 40mm to maybe 80mm.

    anyone have any guestimate as to the R value of what is already in there?

    i was looking to retro-add probably R3 or R3.5 polyester bats on top of it all as a plan.

    but i'm interested to hear whether this is something that can be partially offset with the 'free' insulation offer?

    my understanding is that the insulation offer is only for places that dont currently have ceiling insulation but looking at Energy Efficient Homes Package - Home Insulation Program - Program Guidelines it has a clause about "Negligible Effectiveness" of R0.5 = none.

    any idea how i can determine if what i have is "negligible effectiveness"?
    or can i just qualify anyway?

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    Quote Originally Posted by president_ltd View Post
    We have a 1950s weatherboard in Melbourne that DOES have existing pink-bat insulation, but its pretty ancient, full of soot (black) compacted quite far down in places.
    thickness varies from around 40mm to maybe 80mm.

    anyone have any guestimate as to the R value of what is already in there?
    My guess is the batts were originally rated at R2.0 as that is the lowest figure that's been commonly used to my knowledge. It was only in the 1990's that there was any real change from the commonly accepted R2.5 in colder places (eg ACT, Tasmania) and R2.0 everywhere else. But even in Tas it wasn't uncommon to find R2.0 since that was cheaper.

    As for the soot, that has me wondering. Do you have a fire place or wood heater? If so I'd be checking the chimney / flue for any cracks or damage - better safe than sorry. It's normal to get some soot falling down from a chimney, but still worth checking just to be sure. Or do you live near a present or historic industrial site that used boilers, in which case fall-out (soot, fly ash) may have collected in your roof from there?

    I'm not sure about Pink Batts specifically, but insulation in general only became common in Australian roofs after the 1970's oil price surge as a means of reducing oil consumption (oil heating was very common back then). So I'd guess that your insulation would have been installed sometime after the late-1970's.

    As for getting better insulation, there are plenty of reports of installers who don't seem overly fussed about the official rules. That's not an ideal situation in a lot of ways, but if your taxes are going to be spent then you might as well get something for it...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smurf View Post
    My guess is the batts were originally rated at R2.0 as that is the lowest figure that's been commonly used to my knowledge. It was only in the 1990's that there was any real change from the commonly accepted R2.5 in colder places (eg ACT, Tasmania) and R2.0 everywhere else. But even in Tas it wasn't uncommon to find R2.0 since that was cheaper.

    As for the soot, that has me wondering. Do you have a fire place or wood heater? If so I'd be checking the chimney / flue for any cracks or damage - better safe than sorry. It's normal to get some soot falling down from a chimney, but still worth checking just to be sure. Or do you live near a present or historic industrial site that used boilers, in which case fall-out (soot, fly ash) may have collected in your roof from there?

    I'm not sure about Pink Batts specifically, but insulation in general only became common in Australian roofs after the 1970's oil price surge as a means of reducing oil consumption (oil heating was very common back then). So I'd guess that your insulation would have been installed sometime after the late-1970's.

    As for getting better insulation, there are plenty of reports of installers who don't seem overly fussed about the official rules. That's not an ideal situation in a lot of ways, but if your taxes are going to be spent then you might as well get something for it...
    Did you just encouraged him to defraud a federal goverment ?Hmmmm

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    Quote Originally Posted by manchild View Post
    Did you just encouraged him to defraud a federal goverment ?Hmmmm
    Not as such...

    I just pointed out that the Australian Government has engaged a large number of contractors to install insulation, some of whom are reported by numerous sources to be in the business of defrauding the government.

    By contacting the Australian Government, a visit to your home by one of these contractors can be arranged and it is quite possible that you may be visited by one of those in the business of defrauding government.

    Immoral? Certainly it is. But if someone is arranging their own theft, which is effectively what is reported to be happening, then you might as well see if they're willing to give you some. As a taxpayer, you're paying for all this...

    I'm trying not to be too political here. But if they're just going to dump insulation in the bush, and several councils are having problems like that, then you might as well see if you can get someone to put it in your roof instead. Your hard earned taxpayer $ are being spent either way, so you might as well get some benefit from it.


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