Some hotwater pipes are not copper. Is it right?

Entire houses are now plumbed with PVC pipes, both hot and cold water in lieu of copper.

HTH,

Rubbish Al, Thee is nothing wrong with copper pipes. They said the same thing about the lead ones the Romans used too. I used lead for all our plumbing and just look at me.

Originally Posted by outback

They said the same thing about the lead ones the Romans used

Maybe so, but what have the Romans ever done for us ?

Originally Posted by bsrlee

It should be ABS plastic, not PVC for pressure pipe - ABS is considerably stronger and tends to bend rather than shattering into pointy shards. Is your hotwater heater a gravity/off peak or a mains/on demand unit? PVC should be OK for a gravity system, otherwise its used for waste water/drainage.

Plastic is plastic as far as I'm concerned.

Originally Posted by Gumby

Maybe so, but what have the Romans ever done for us ?

They invented Salami Sausage

and pizza

and roman sandals

dunno bout roman candles though

Parent's house was built in 1996 and is fully plumbed in plastic. All the junctions and joinres are brass with push fit fittings. Took only a day to plumb a very large house with little other equipment apart from a drill and a hacksaw - no solder, gas bottles and other OHS threats plus it was quick. The plumber thought this stuff was marvellous and after ten years and no dramas so do the olds.

If you are interested http://www.auspex.com.au/PushFitSystem/ & http://www.reece.com.au/plumbing/products/talbot

Originally Posted by echnidna

They invented Salami Sausage

and pizza

and roman sandals

dunno bout roman candles though

Wotabout
Roman in the gloamin'?

Originally Posted by bsrlee

It should be ABS plastic, not PVC for pressure pipe - ABS is considerably stronger and tends to bend rather than shattering into pointy shards. Is your hotwater heater a gravity/off peak or a mains/on demand unit? PVC should be OK for a gravity system, otherwise its used for waste water/drainage.

I was under the impression that PVC or more accurately UPVC was no longer used for water pipes because of the chlorine gas leakage?

I was also under the impression that they were going to faze it out for stormwater and sewer because of some environmental byproducts with the manufacturing process.

I may have this wrong so if you know... post away.

Rats have been known to chew holes in pex, polybutylene and PVC pipes, but as far as I know they don't chew copper pipes.

Mick

A plumber mate down near Brissie refuses to use anything but copper because he's had to replace rat damaged pipes.

Mick

I've just spent the last 2 hrs trawling through information about the dangers of PVC.

I will never buy a tray of meat from woolies with glad wrap on again.

What about tupperware containers.....Jeez I feel sick.

If half this information is correct (some of it is obvious scare mongering by greenpeace etc and some is propaganda by the industrial lobby) some is informative and unbiased.......

What is up with this world where corporations put profits above their customers health ?

Originally Posted by silentC

Can you believe you just asked that?

Yes, sorry about that a momentary lapse of cynicism

Originally Posted by Jessie

Hi, all

Our bathroom is being renovated. The plumber just installed hotwater pipes behind the wall today. I noticed that majority of pipes are made of copper but some are not, they look like black plastic and about 50cm to 80cm long. The plumber said they are used to prevent vibration when the tap is turned on. As far as I know, in the old days, all hotwater pipes were made of copper/brass.

Is there something wrong or I am far behind new technology?

Thank you

Jessie

It sounds like some kind of hammer arrester.

Originally Posted by journeyman Mick

A plumber mate down near Brissie refuses to use anything but copper because he's had to replace rat damaged pipes.

Mick

They ate out a trap on a sink that I had just sitting in the garage. Chewed out a big hole in it for god knows what reason and they've chewed through a few of my cables as well. I hope they don't start on my drainage.
I've heard that they're putting some kind of poison to repel them from cable nowadays. I don't know about PVC but it's a real problem if these ratbags can get sustenance from sparks and sewer services.

Originally Posted by Master Splinter

* A major component of acid rain, found in tumors, indicated as a causal factor in many fatal car accidents, causes rapid corrosion of steel, and overdosing on it is fatal.

That's nasty stuff alright. Watch out for it, it's all over the place.

Originally Posted by Master Splinter

The first 15 pages of results on Google for PVC dangers seemed to be mostly greenpeace/blogs/consumer concerns and paranoia sites.

I hate to say it, but the members of these sorts of organisations would happily sign the petition to ban the use of dihydrogen monoxide*. Well meaning, but not a clue (and that's discounting the automatic anti big business slant that often goes with them).

This site likes to actually check what they are claiming by actually looking at the research findings, rather than just running the latest scare story verbatim.

Yes MS as I said in my post I am aware that there is a lot of hippy dippy scare mongering.
But you have to be aware that even when you have a site claiming "We do not earn any income from the chemical Industry" that it doesn't mean that thet are not set up by the industry and get there incomes stream through a third party.

I must admit I didnt read the site blurb that you linked to because as soon as I opened it , it looked like the other "We want to debunk those damn greenies that are spreading these lies" type sites. My oppologies if I'm wrong.
Try this link which I found very unbiased and they manufacture childrens toys!http://www.turnertoys.com/PVC_framepage1.htm

The water pipe they use is poltybutelyne, it is a smoother bore than copper and is also a larger size slightly, eg the copper 1/2 inch is now 18 mm and the 3/4 is now 22mm so the pipe is actually bigger and flows better. There is nothing wrong with it in my job i have tested it under pressure, they ussually blow at (8-9000 kpa) and even then the pipe splits and the joint stay put,.

Pex pipe is used for high pressure gas and has the added benefit of being hard wearing, Its also used for hospital type applications because hospital pipes are often super heated overnight to kill bacteria and the regular pipe cant handle it.

Originally Posted by bricks

Pex pipe is used for high pressure gas and has the added benefit of being hard wearing.

Pex water supply lines are now becoming standard over here in many cities, especially as the price of copper escalates. While it is expensive, the time saved in labour to install it makes it worthwhile. And you can control the various lines much more easily as it uses a manifold system, not unlike the electrical mains breakers in the house.

But if the house is built on a slab, the pex usuallly runs through the attic. It can be buried in the slab but must be sleeved wherever it penetrates in or out. It would probably be even more widely used except for a lack of trained installers.

Originally Posted by Honorary Bloke

Pex water supply lines are now becoming standard over here in many cities, especially as the price of copper escalates.

I believe that you're allowed to do your own plumbing in the states. Is this the case Bob?

Silent C,
If you click on your own link, go to the top of the page and click water supply you will come to a page that has the products they use for water supply i dont see pex pipe here, i do see iplex pro fit which is polybutelyne.

If you go to plumbing you will see Iplex future 1 pipe which is a pex gas pipe.

Future 2 is a new product and i have never ever ever seen it in a domestic situation, only comercial.

Pex pipe in australia is really only used for gas or comercial installations such as hospitals which you so kindly neglected to quote.

Jessies pipes are black, Iplex pro fit is grey,Iplex future 2 is grey, what he has is Rehau pipe, which once again is polybutelyne.

Pex wont eliminate Poly because it costs more, plumbing ( like everything) is a profit driven industry if it costs more it aint being used.

Originally Posted by pawnhead

I believe that you're allowed to do your own plumbing in the states. Is this the case Bob?

To some extent, yes. You can do your own plumbing for:

Repairs to existing fittings and fixtures (for example, replace a hot water heater, fix a leak, etc.)

New fittings and fixtures that do not require a building permit to install (for example, replace a tap, tap an existing water line to run a new water line to a different room, etc.)

In fact, you can do your own plumbing even if it does require a permit, but you will have to have it inspected by the local building commission. About the only plumbing requiring a permit would be connecting directly to the city water line or changing the footprint of your home (adding a room).

Here is a link to more than you ever wanted to know about PEX plumbing,

http://www.ppfahome.org/pex/faqpex.html

Bricks,
maybe Pex isn't used for plumbing in SA, but it sure is in Qld. And it's definitely Pex, not polybutylene.

Mick

Originally Posted by Cabbie

There was a case though of someone making a petition or something about "dihydrogen monoxide" saying how dangerous it was and loads of ppl fell for it. I aint sure where I saw or read that I just thought it funny because if they stopped and thought they would realise what it was hehe.

There have been lots of cases, but probably the most famous case of the gullible would have been the Viejo City Council: -

In March 2004, Aliso Viejo, California almost considered banning the use of foam containers at city-sponsored events because dihydrogen monoxide is part of their production. The issue was put on the agenda of the City Council after a paralegal found mention of DHMO online and did not realize it was a joke. The item was pulled from the agenda before it could come to a vote, but not before the city received a raft of bad publicity

?

Originally Posted by bricks

Pex pipe in australia is really only used for gas or comercial installations such as hospitals which you so kindly neglected to quote.

Have some respect for your elders sonny Jim. Someone needs to tan your hide with a switch by golly by gumbo by crikey! In my day, my old pappy woulda had me lickin his bootstraps for being so cheeky.

Originally Posted by silentC

Sometimes it helps to actually read what's on the page instead of just looking at the headings.

Originally Posted by silentC

A 26 year old who knows it all! Who would have thought

These young whipersnappers need to be bent over your knee and given a good paddlin'!

And all the "young Einstein" all can come up with is : -

Originally Posted by bricks

?

PS I'd still like to know how many plumbers it takes to change a light bulb.

I am a construction manager for a nation wide plumbing company, we employ over 250 liscenced plumbers.

It is my job to know these things,
But im only 26,
Perhaps i should go back to trade school?

When new products become available, my company works closely with mainly S.A. water and the office of the technical regulator to feild test the products. When products are approved for use, my company is usually the at the forefront of their introduction into the industry.

I asked my Iplex rep today why pex pipes are labeled as for Domestic Cold Water, he told me it is a technical term to distinguish clean water possibly for drinking from other water. Some pipe systems introduce contamination to the water.

Seriously im over it.

Originally Posted by bricks

Seriously im over it.

I'm just havin a lend of ya Bricksy. I'm sure there's lots of good stuff in that brain of yours, ripe for pickin, so I'd better not paddle your bum just yet.

Originally Posted by bricks

Seriously im over it.

Originally Posted by silentC

You give up too easy.

Try some Sorbolene on that hide of yours Bricksy.

I was only trying to help poor jessie out, how do you think he feels causing this big rift between two woodies?

Silent C seriously i believe you, im not on the eastern side of the country, they may well use pex as standard, It will work, it is legal.

This i do know, In adelaide where i work, pex is not common, it is normally either pro fit brand or rehau brand, I have used it once, that was only in a hospital, because regular pipe wouldnt cope with the sterilization processes. Beleive it or not it was very interesting.

Tempering valves are mandatory in all new work. I've fitted PB piping to a large boat (accomodation for 48) with 8 bathrooms, plus an extra 2 toilets plus a commercial kitchen (and yes I know they're called heads and galleys). PB was used because it was an aluminium boat and copper tends to eat holes through aluminium via electrolysis. The boat has been in constant service for about ten years now, and no problems with the plumbing besides some initial failed fittings due to poor placement/angles and movement with extreme weather situations, everything has been fine.

Up till a few years ago, PB was being used very extensively on quite a few communities up on Cape York as their water supplies were attacking copper piping. I believe that it's now mostly been superseded by PEX.
PB specs call for (from memory) the first metre of line out of a hws to be
copper.

I don't believe they've done a dodgy on you.

Mick