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Nail type for particle board subfloor installation

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  1. #1
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    Default Nail type for particle board subfloor installation

    Hi,

    Got about 100m2 of particle board (yellow tongue) to install onto +100 year old hardwood joists. Read the manufacturer installation guide which recommends the use of 50-65x2.5mm D head nails when machine driven into hardwood (I have a Hikoki framing nailer). Instructions also haven a footnote to use galvanised nails designated for wet areas. My question is, what is the best shank type in terms of holding power for this application? Looks like the options are smooth (which will be a bit rough with a hot dip gal coating), ring shank (seems to be for softwoods), or screw shank (Paslode brochure says better holding power in hardwood but I have doubts based on some of the posts here). I will be using a suitable glue too. The other option is to screw and glue, but that might take an eternity.

    Cheers

  2. #2
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    If your joists are 100 year old HW then you might might need to consider welding it down.

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    Interested to follow the replies. I will be needing to do something similar in the near future. I was planning on glue and screw as I don't have a nailer.

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    Just did one like that a few months ago. i just liquid nail it and use 50mm framing nails for hardwood. Put 5 nails per joist and 6 on the ends. Come in about 30mm - 50mm from the edge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sol381 View Post
    Just did one like that a few months ago. i just liquid nail it and use 50mm framing nails for hardwood. Put 5 nails per joist and 6 on the ends. Come in about 30mm - 50mm from the edge.
    Thanks for the tips. I’ll likely do the same but use Bostik Ultraset instead. Other option I’ve looked at is to hire a screw gun. Since it’s a cut in floor, by the time I’ve stuffed about measuring and cutting, my offsider might have time to screw a sheet down (and make a brew). Only considering screws because in a previous place the floor was glued and nailed and it started squeaking a few years later. No subfloor access so just had to live with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Stinkalot View Post
    Interested to follow the replies. I will be needing to do something similar in the near future. I was planning on glue and screw as I don't have a nailer.
    Will let you know what is used in the end. Might hire a collated screw gun to speed things up if we go that route.

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    Maybe a bit late but to add my 2 cents, I did this a number of years ago and had no end of trouble with the heads of the screws snapping off if I didn't pre- drill the joists (incidentally same issue with plasterboard screws in the walls)

    Right or wrong I wound up hand driving concrete nails as everything else would bend and the cheap nailer I had at the time wouldn't sink them all the way no matter what I did

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsmith View Post
    Will let you know what is used in the end. Might hire a collated screw gun to speed things up if we go that route.
    Good luck, if it's seasoned hardwood it will be like steel, so nailing is the best option, as you will probably snap more screws than you screw in,
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDub View Post
    Maybe a bit late but to add my 2 cents, I did this a number of years ago and had no end of trouble with the heads of the screws snapping off if I didn't pre- drill the joists (incidentally same issue with plasterboard screws in the walls)

    Right or wrong I wound up hand driving concrete nails as everything else would bend and the cheap nailer I had at the time wouldn't sink them all the way no matter what I did
    Thanks PDub. Now that you mention it, I recall have the same issue installing batten clips in some old hardwood ceiling joists a few years ago. I bought the gun specifically to drive nails into hardwood so hopefully it works as advertised.

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    Quote Originally Posted by METRIX View Post
    Good luck, if it's seasoned hardwood it will be like steel, so nailing is the best option, as you will probably snap more screws than you screw in,
    Thanks METRIX. I'm assuming regular bright or maybe electro-gal nails are the go when used in combination with Ultraset or similar?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsmith View Post
    I bought the gun specifically to drive nails into hardwood so hopefully it works as advertised.
    What gun did you get ?
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Quote Originally Posted by METRIX View Post
    What gun did you get ?
    I ended up getting a Hikoki 18V framing gun. It was that or an air gun. A deal came up on this one so that's what I ended up with.

    https://hikokipowertools.com.au/cord...raming-nailer/

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    Probably the best all round framer you can buy.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsmith View Post
    I ended up getting a Hikoki 18V framing gun. It was that or an air gun. A deal came up on this one so that's what I ended up with.

    https://hikokipowertools.com.au/cord...raming-nailer/
    Nice gun, as Sol said probably the best framer out there, as well as the 18V Milwaukee.

    What deal did you get, I was looking at getting one of the Hitachi or Milwalkee.
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Quote Originally Posted by METRIX View Post
    Nice gun, as Sol said probably the best framer out there, as well as the 18V Milwaukee.

    What deal did you get, I was looking at getting one of the Hitachi or Milwalkee.
    I got a combo from Sydney Tools because I needed a finishing gun too. After selling the redemption item and the included saw I didn't need, it wasn't much more than the Milwaukee battery and framing gun only combo. The framing guns seem to be more or less the same from what I can tell.

  16. #16
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    Is Hikoki the same as Hitachi? Oh yes, +Koki ... what chance is there to drive nails in hardwood? I had a few occasions I needed to do that and tried with an air nail gun that shoots like a bazooka and ... no luck. It drove the nail halfway and bounced or bent the nail. Maybe with a shorter steel nail or concreting nails?
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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    i have all milwaukee tools so will probably get a milwaukee gun.. Judging by the tests done it is the most powerful and pretty quick, but heavy. The finishing guns have a major fault so just waiting to see if the framer is the same. Not sure why hitachi changed its name. hikoki doesnt sound as good. 50mm framing nails will go into hardwood. 75 will struggle. 50mm is more than enough for yellow tongue.

    Metrix. As much as i like milwaukee i wouldnt get a milwaukee finshing gun. Ive got 3 dead ones at home. great when they work but they just seem to break down. As for the framer, its a beast but it is pretty heavy.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sol381 View Post
    Not sure why hitachi changed its name. hikoki doesnt sound as good
    Here's how, it's become very confusing.

    Hitachi Koki is the powertool division of Hitachi Ltd, in 2016 Hitachi bought Metabo power tools, then in 2017 Hitachi Koki was purchased by KKP (Henry Kravis investment firm)

    After the buyout, KKP decided to change the name to Koki Holdings and also decided to change the name to HIKOKI as part of a world wide rebranding.

    Metabo in Australia is still called Metabo, but in North America they decided to change the Metabo name to Metabo HPT which doesn't make sense as the tools are completely different with no interchangeability of parts batteries etc ???
    The industry has said it's a bad move as all it's done is confused the customers.
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Is Hikoki the same as Hitachi? Oh yes, +Koki ... what chance is there to drive nails in hardwood? I had a few occasions I needed to do that and tried with an air nail gun that shoots like a bazooka and ... no luck. It drove the nail halfway and bounced or bent the nail. Maybe with a shorter steel nail or concreting nails?
    What was the wood species, Marc? I don't think the stuff in my place is al that hard. When I was pulling up the floorboards the prybar dinged up the edge of the joists pretty easily. Maybe it's Vic Ash or one of the softer hardwoods. I've got some scrap joists and studs that I can shoot a few nails into to test out the gun.

  20. #20
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    Probably yellow box or tallow wood, 50 years old. Hard as steel
    Fear is the foundation of most government.
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