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Help/Advice needed from the floor sanding pros

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  1. #1
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    Default Help/Advice needed from the floor sanding pros

    Hello,

    Currently in the process of sanding our floorboards at home. I have so far done the cross cut sanding and then with the grain using 40 grit, then sanded again with the grain using 60 grit.

    The issue I have is that there are several dark stains in the timber (See Photos) that haven't sanded out therefore I'm thinking deep in the timber.

    I'm hoping to get some help with what my options are?

    Looking at using Bona Traffic or Intergrain Enviropro and original plan was to put this down on the natural timber for a natural look. I'm now open to staining first but would this hide the dark stains? Any suggestions on colours? Don't want to go too dark, something lighter than the original stain you can see around edges in the photos!

    Cheers

    Craig
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails img_1547.jpg   img_1544.jpg   img_1546.jpg   img_1549.jpg  

  2. #2
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    Anyone used Oxalic Acid on stains like this?

    If so, how did it go? and is it recommended?

  3. #3
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    Hey,

    Im not a pro by any means but i was in the business for 5 years.

    That last photo looks as if there was some damage to cause the stain - maybe water damage ?? You can also see the dark stains under the original coating on the edge. Your using a hummel (tick no. one) so if you cant sand that out now by going over it with a fresh 40 belt, its not coming out at all. Staining the floor might disguise the stain a bit but there is always a risk it will darken further (will still be less noticeable than natural). Its a shame because thats a really nice looking floor. You could have a crack with an orbital sander on some of the stains to test out the sand ability before you take the whole floor back.

    Have used both Bona and Enviropro - prefer Bona traffic, its a slightly superior product. I hear there is a new product called "Loba" and its the bee knees but i have never used it.

    My gut feeling is that its not going to come out but thats timber.

    Good luck!

    Michael

  4. #4
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    Thanks for the reply!

    I think the floors were carpeted for a long time before a previous owner sanded and coated them, so I think the stains are from spillages etc during that time.

    I considered replacing some or all of the stained boards but they are 140mm wide and have been unsuccessful in tracking any down so looks like we are stuck with it.

    I'm thinking of trying some oxalis acid in a test patch out of sight to see if I can dull them down a little. Will post a pic if it's successful.

    I have ended up going with the bona traffic and one of their drifast stains so it's good to hear you recommend it.

    Cheers

    Craig

  5. #5
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    I would put the acid on a piece of wood and then apply all the stain/coatings that you plan on putting on the floor to test for any reactions.

    Ive never used any acids on a floor but i know that coatings can react to the most unexpected and simple things .. like sweat so who knows what acid might do ??

    all the best

    Cheers

  6. #6
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    Thanks that is something I didn't consider, I may just have to learn to live with the stains rather than risk stuffing up the coating!

    Cheers

  7. #7
    Senior Member shanetorque's Avatar
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    Default Help/Advice needed from the floor sanding pros

    I wouldn't hesitate to give those areas another quick 40 crosscut. Remember that going over the floor with finer grits won't remove anymore of the stain, most if the material is removed with the coarser grits.
    DriFast is a great product and easy to use. And I use traffic all the time and love it.
    Australian Timber Flooring Association Contractor of the Year 2012/13

  8. #8
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    Thanks shanetorque for your reply.

    Since those photos I did do a second crosscut pass with the 40 grit which lightened them up a little but did not get rid of them.

    I am about to start coating with the traffic in the next day or so and wondering how much time do I have where the wet edge stays wet?

    Cheers

  9. #9
    Senior Member shanetorque's Avatar
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    Default Help/Advice needed from the floor sanding pros

    I assume you'll be using a primer first? Either way its the first coat that really needs to be Mickey Mouse. I would only cut in 500-750mm at each end and roll the full length of the room. Try to stick to the correct coverage but also be consistent. This means a little more or a little less depending on your style. If you use a little less it is worth going in for a fourth coat to make sure the overall thickness is right in the end.
    Australian Timber Flooring Association Contractor of the Year 2012/13

  10. #10
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    Yes to a primer first.

    Thanks for the info. I'm also trying to get an idea of roughly how long before the wet edge starts to go off? Just planning the way I'm going to work around the job.

    Cheers

  11. #11
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    You will see the coating starting to matt-out. Timing is really a matter of several factors - temperature, humidity etc..

    You dont want to roll back over the coating once it starts to matt otherwise you might end up with overlap marks.

    If you need to structure you coating, plan to cut it off along the edge of a board. That way you can come back and cut in along the edge on the opposite board.

  12. #12
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    Well the floors are coated, 1x primer and 2x traffic, whilst it looks ok after following the bona instructions I'm not completely satisfied with how our finish ended up. What I'm referring to is the surface feels rough from the raised wood fibers! I don't want to fork out more money for another bottle of traffic to add another coat so I am wondering can I cutback the surface and use the bona refresher maintenance product?

    Any advice is appreciated.

  13. #13
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    Did you cut back between coats?

    We coat primer and then first coat. This is followed by a cut back with 180 grit on Trio and final coat - nice and smooth.

    You do get significant grain rise with water based coatings so its essential to cut back properly.

    A good cut back and forth coat would likely fix it.

  14. #14
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    Thanks again for your reply.

    I cutback between the two topcoat, using the polivac, but not after the primer as per bona instructions. I used a blue cutting pad which is for between coats but may not have had the coarseness of a screen mesh. Do you know much about the bona refresher product?

  15. #15
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    Sorry, I dont know anything about the refresher product.

    I cant recall that we ever cut back between primer and first coat, so i think your ok there. Anyway, it wouldnt take much to cut through the primer and back to raw timber so your better off just cutting between the second and final coat as you did.

    Ive had limited experience with a polyvac as we exclusively used the lagler trio which IMO is 100 times better than the polyvac - but that may just be due to my limited use.

    sounds like the blue pads might be too fine for cut back - i know screens are fairly abrasive for cutting back as we use to use them but now its all 180 grit sia discs (also blue).

    I know traffic is not cheap esp when you have a decent area to cover - maybe someone else has some experience with the refresher or otherwise speak to the supplier that you bought the traffic from and see what they have to suggest.

    Good luck!

  16. #16
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    Thanks again.

    I had the blue pads from when I sanded and coated a bedroom last year using Synteko Classic. They worked great for cutting back the Synteko but being solvent had no wood fibre raising!

    I will go visit the bona distributor as you suggest and have a chat to them next week.

    Cheers

  17. #17
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    Not sure what those pads are like that you used but generally you dont re-use cut back pads on another floor.

    Maybe the polyvac ones are some kind of long life type pads but yeah that could really be a factor - not enough grit for the cut back.

  18. #18
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    Sorry it was a new one, I just meant same type. I had it left over!

  19. #19
    Senior Member shanetorque's Avatar
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    Default Help/Advice needed from the floor sanding pros

    Correct me if I'm wrong but the blue pads may be for burnishing not cutting back?
    If done correctly you should have left the floor with a chalky dust over it after cutting back. I use P150 screens between coats. Always new discs too!
    Australian Timber Flooring Association Contractor of the Year 2012/13

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