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Shower Screed vs Preformed Tray.

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  1. #1
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    Default Shower Screed vs Preformed Tray.

    I am having a bathroom reno (doing much of the work myself). The job includes replacing a 900 x 900 corner shower and base with a tiled walk in arrangement. The floor is yellow tongue. One tiler wants to remove the YT under the base, and cut down the joists, then put in a screed to tile. However, I have been looking at drop-in preformed trays for tiling (eg Universal Shower Base), which appear simpler, cleaner and more water-proof, and would not require cutting into the joists...plus I could install this myself (saving $$$), and then have the pros for the water-proofing and laying the tiles. Can anyone advise on the pros and cons of these options, please?

  2. #2
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    Cannot speak with regard to other options but recently used a Universal Shower Base in our reno, will be using the same in the future ensuite.

  3. #3
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    If the base of the shower will be lower than the rest of the floor, how do you not have to adjust the floor joists?
    Growing old is compulsory, growing up is not.
    http://www.wet-seal.com.au/waterproofing/locations.html

  4. #4
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    I used two ezilay shower base's from Highgrove in my recent renovation, they are 25mm (19mm yellow tongue plus 6mm tile underlay) thick so the yellow tongue would still have to come out and the be re installed inbetween the joists as the base needs to be fully supported, but no joists cut. I don't have any experience with screed but I found the ezilay bases to work well and were simple to install/cost effective.

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    One of the more common failures of showers on timber floors with plastic bases is movement in the structure, followed by failure of the waste connection 'O' ring or just poor installation. It's important that any chance of movement of the plastic or fibreglass base is done properly.

    My preference is to make sure the support timbers are braced, particularly around the outer edges of the structure to eliminate any movement, keeping in mind that timber swells and shrinks depending on moisture, ventilation, type of timber used and structural stability.

    I prefer to waterproof the area before the tray is installed, this means installing a strip of material between the wall studs to provide a flat surface to apply the waterproofing membrane on the fixed walls and the floor. Also, install a puddle flange to ensure that if or when water does get under the shower tray it can be drained without damage.

    The cheaper method is to use an Aluminium angle 50mm by 50mm for a shower up to one metre by one metre. Not practical for larger showers because of the extra length and fall required. Using a 50mm angle means the top of the outer tiles will be 10 mm from the top of the angle, thus providing a water stop for the glass. Leaving the lower 20 mm of exposed angle on the outside to be covered by the floor tiles. so by using a little extra tile glue and sloping that first tile away from the shower angle, you have a walk-in shower, you could spread the fall over more than one tile to make all but invisible. You will still need a puddle flang to meet the standards though.

    I use the Anodised polished finish 50 mm angle available from Ullrich Aluminium.

    I can do an article on how to make your own shower angles if you think it might be a challenge.

    Good luck and fair winds.
    Growing old is compulsory, growing up is not.
    http://www.wet-seal.com.au/waterproofing/locations.html

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbalse View Post
    , I have been looking at drop-in preformed trays for tiling (eg Universal Shower Base), which appear simpler, cleaner and more water-proof, and would not require cutting into the joists...plus I could install this myself (saving $$$), and then have the pros for the water-proofing and laying the tiles. Can anyone advise on the pros and cons of these options, please?
    As Oldsaltoz says

    Don't be tricked into thinking these pre formed trays are more waterproof, from my experience in ripping out bathrooms and seeing them leaking over the years they are far from foolproof.
    Problems arose from bad install (not enough or incorrectly installed supports) and leaking at the outlet (damaged O ring probably due to bad install and allowing movement on something that wasn't meant to move).
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Thanks, for the backup Metrix, as you say "Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir." Prevention is better than cure".

    Growing old is compulsory, growing up is not.
    http://www.wet-seal.com.au/waterproofing/locations.html

  8. #8
    Seasoned DIY droog's Avatar
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    when water does get under the shower tray it can be drained without damage.
    For reference so we are talking about the same thing thr "Universal Shower Base" i am talking about is a replacement of the floor, no puddle flange needed.

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    Hi Droog, Yes we are talking about the same thing. Installed one a few weeks back. Fully waterproofed under the tray and installed a puddle flange as required by the Standards. The cost of the tray $500.00+. Cost of the waterproofing $426.00 including two niches in the shower and full floor. as this shower was a 3 wall job it would have cost around $16.00 to supply and install an angle.

    Good luck and fair winds.



    https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/UNIVERSA...-/112329227621
    Growing old is compulsory, growing up is not.
    http://www.wet-seal.com.au/waterproofing/locations.html

  10. #10
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    ripping up the subfloor and cutting joists is....crazy. The cost would be super high. I suppose the tiler wants to do a typcial 50mm screed. Does he know if you can rip down the floor joists 50mm. Oh wait he's a tiler and not licensed to even think about floor joists.

    Follow the previous suggestions. Waterproof the room before you bring in the unit. Install it. waterproof as much as possible around it. Chances are it will be fine. If it leaks, the room is waterproofed.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldsaltoz View Post
    as this shower was a 3 wall job it would have cost around $16.00 to supply and install an angle.

    Good luck and fair winds.

    There's your answer
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheHammer View Post
    ripping up the subfloor and cutting joists is....crazy. The cost would be super high. I suppose the tiler wants to do a typcial 50mm screed. Does he know if you can rip down the floor joists 50mm. Oh wait he's a tiler and not licensed to even think about floor joists.

    .

    Mmm, Yes seen this done before, then they load it up with shyt loads of screed and tiles, and wonder why things tend to break
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldsaltoz View Post
    One of the more common failures of showers on timber floors with plastic bases is movement in the structure, followed by failure of the waste connection 'O' ring or just poor installation. It's important that any chance of movement of the plastic or fibreglass base is done properly.

    We are having to have a bathroom floor removed entirely right now due to this - the plastic base cracked, the waste fell down and water was escaping around the waste.

  14. #14
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    Not sure why people still use shower trays anymore.. they are uglier and more expensive and if the waste isnt in exactly the same position then you have to get the plumber to move it..also the shower screen fits a lot nicer on a flat tiles floor.

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    G'day Simon,
    This could have been avoided if the shower base was fully waterproofed before the tray was installed, including a puddle flange.

    Good luck and fair winds.
    Growing old is compulsory, growing up is not.
    http://www.wet-seal.com.au/waterproofing/locations.html

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by sol381 View Post
    Not sure why people still use shower trays anymore.. they are uglier and more expensive and if the waste isnt in exactly the same position then you have to get the plumber to move it..also the shower screen fits a lot nicer on a flat tiles floor.
    Sure are.
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

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