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Remove architrave and squareset windows/doors

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  1. #1
    Apprentice (new member) fuzzboy's Avatar
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    Default Remove architrave and squareset windows/doors

    Looking to sharpen up the place and achieve a minimalist look after getting the concrete floor polished. First port of call is the cornices which I've removed and now looking for quotes to squareset professionally (I'm not going anywhere near that work!). So far for approx 70 linear metres of work I've had one quote for over $7500 cash which seems a bit excessive. I guess that's another story though.

    My main question relates to the existing windows and doors where the architrave has been removed by myself. There's quite a substantial gap of at least 10mm between the plasterboard and doorframes and window reveals. After what seems to be a whole week of googling information and conflicting perspectives I'm sort of being lead down the path of stuffing that void with insulation and possibly a layer of caulk/acrylic sealant over the top. Using expanding foam has universally been advised against even though it seems to be a great solution. There's no doubt I'll need to use a plaster bead but I'm a little confused on attaching to the frame/reveal or leaving a gap for expansion. Also might do a door in shadowline just to see what it looks like.

    From the pics, does it look there's enough for the plasterboard for the stopping angle to attach to and will the small lip plastered up look ok against the frame? Also, what would be the best order to do everything. I was planning on stapling the stopping angle after filling the gap but still need to leave a small gap to fit flush against the frame. This product - Siniat 10 x 3000mm PVC Tearaway L Bead Plaster Trim ​looks to be a good fit.

    I'll be doing this myself and want to do it the right way so can take my time but definitely don't want to have to remove any framing etc.

    Pics of door for reference -
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 4f16b62e-ee17-499a-8ebb-7fea6f9152a0.jpg   img_5325.jpg   img_5326.jpg   img_5327.jpg  

  2. #2
    Apprentice (new member) fuzzboy's Avatar
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    Much the same situation at windows. Happy with the reveals as is but was considering at one stage an option such as Ezy-Reveal but 90mm depth makes it easier to finish plastering flush against it, they look ok anyway. Also, advice on filling gaps with insulation/foam etc may be focused on colder climate countries.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails img_5322.jpg   img_5321.jpg   img_5320.jpg  

  3. #3
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    Filling the gap keeps wind out and heat / cold in. You only get one chance so make the most of it!

    On one window I used a ‘low expansion’ expansion foam - but it was quite expensive.

    So on some other windows I used insulation scraps.

    On some other gaps I used foam (either the extruded foam that comes in a long tube shape - or grey foam expansion joint, cut slightly oversize and squeezed in the gap.

  4. #4
    Je pense, donc METRIX's Avatar
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    Good luck getting a good finish with either shadow line, or squareset around existing old style jambs / reveals.
    Many have tried to do this with existing windows / doors that were never designed for that purpose and have failed.

    There are many reasons why it's such a hard thing to achieve, from the type of window / reveal / door jambs that were used, regular stuff is not designed for this, they don't cope with the expansion of the different materials such as non shrink / expandable plaster to wood that continually expands / contracts, to many other reasons that have been discussed on here many times, least of all how fiddly it is to achieve it, let alone to achieve a quality finish.

    The arcs not only cover the gaps left behind they also act as reinforcement for the frames to minimise movement, take them off and you instantly have a less stable door jamb / window reveal, couple with with a non shrink plaster and you're just sitting by waiting for the cracks to start showing.

    My advice is, if you want to go to the trouble of square setting the ceiling, then go for it, you will find even this is not as easy as it sounds.

    It's the same reason it's not a simple matter of doing it to windows / doors, that's because, when these were installed the extra work involved at the framing stage was not done to accommodate for this, so trying to retrofit it afterwards is usually a lot costlier, and the correct reveals / jambs were not specified that facilitate that look you are after.

    I would just install a newer profile architrave / skirting such as splayed, or rectangle, these look modern without being obtrusive, at the end of the day anything can be done.

    It comes down to either how much you want to spend to get it done, and how much hassle you want to go to trying to achieve an acceptable result.
    I have done it on one house in the past, it was a painful process to do, yes it did look good, was it worth it, lets say I am not in a hurry to do it again.
    Mieux vaut prévenir que guérir

  5. #5
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    agree on something like the splayed architrave - painting in same white as the wall, but with semi gloss makes it far more modern than the differential colours and pencil round 9like you have)

    for cornices - plasterer doesnt want job, but figures if you are dumb enough to pay $7k, well...... The way I had it done at my place, is set circular saw to 13mm and run the plate against the wall all the way round, then go back and do the same to the wall - so you end up with about a 100mm all the way round the wall and the ceiling (always cut both before removing obviously). then cut board and install - cheaters method is to cut the board on the rear and fold to give an internal corner - the better way is to put a metal internal corner and base coat it in - this gives a far straighter edge

  6. #6
    JB1
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    Probably not what you want to hear but I think time/money would be better spent on new double glazed windows with reveals that are designed to be square set than trying to square set an old single glazed sliding windows. The beige colour window frames doesn't really lend itself to the modern look you're after anyway.

    As above, a modern profile architrave is a good compromise until you replace the windows.

  7. #7
    Apprentice (new member) fuzzboy's Avatar
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    Fellas, (esp Metrix) appreciate the healthy dose of reality. I never really thought about architraves giving structural support.

    No doubt you've all experienced that single-mindedness to achieve a goal, irrespective of pitfalls along the way. I really dislike ornate stuff and even though my place is relatively young being a brick home built in 95, it's been a slow process to replace a country style kitchen and slowly have the place morph into the vision of a minimalist art gallery. The rose-coloured glasses weigh heavily every time I look at a room and envisage all the potential clean lines.

    Luckily, I've found a builder/plasterer who has quoted incredibly competitive rates for the work I want done. Working a job and then coming home and spending a couple of hours each night slaving away . . . yeah the novelty wears off. He has strongly advised using shadowline to cover any imperfections in level between plaster and door jamb/window reveal so I'm running with that.

    Happy to provide details by PM also after mid-next week pending the outcome of the job and very realistic about the trade-offs and long term finish of going ahead with it all.

    In the meantime, I've been stuffing the cracks between the plasterboard and floor with Abelflex Rod Filler before installing skirting boards and will probably do the door/window gaps for a little extra acoustic & insulative effect.

    02-en_au-abelrod-1x1_hybrisproductimages.jpg

  8. #8
    Apprentice (new member) fuzzboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB1 View Post
    Probably not what you want to hear but I think time/money would be better spent on new double glazed windows with reveals that are designed to be square set than trying to square set an old single glazed sliding windows. The beige colour window frames doesn't really lend itself to the modern look you're after anyway.

    As above, a modern profile architrave is a good compromise until you replace the windows.
    Yeah I've agonised over the windows for a while but made my peace with them. Went down the rabbit hole of painting over powdercoated materials and even though I've got a compressor the fiddly factor is to the moon in prep. In any case, we've had security screens installed so they need to last a bit. In the scale of priorities a bathroom reno sits a lot higher.

    When we first moved in all the door /cupboard handles etc were gold, very Saddam Hussein kitsch! Those windows are testament to a differing design perspective for sure but for under $2000 to shadowline all the existing ones plus doors then I'm willing to cop it if it's a failed experiment.

    (BTW this post has gone through before a longer explanatory post pending mod approval)

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by METRIX View Post
    Good luck getting a good finish with either shadow line, or squareset around existing old style jambs / reveals.
    Many have tried to do this with existing windows / doors that were never designed for that purpose and have failed.

    There are many reasons why it's such a hard thing to achieve, from the type of window / reveal / door jambs that were used, regular stuff is not designed for this, they don't cope with the expansion of the different materials such as non shrink / expandable plaster to wood that continually expands / contracts, to many other reasons that have been discussed on here many times, least of all how fiddly it is to achieve it, let alone to achieve a quality finish.

    The arcs not only cover the gaps left behind they also act as reinforcement for the frames to minimise movement, take them off and you instantly have a less stable door jamb / window reveal, couple with with a non shrink plaster and you're just sitting by waiting for the cracks to start showing.

    My advice is, if you want to go to the trouble of square setting the ceiling, then go for it, you will find even this is not as easy as it sounds.

    It's the same reason it's not a simple matter of doing it to windows / doors, that's because, when these were installed the extra work involved at the framing stage was not done to accommodate for this, so trying to retrofit it afterwards is usually a lot costlier, and the correct reveals / jambs were not specified that facilitate that look you are after.

    I would just install a newer profile architrave / skirting such as splayed, or rectangle, these look modern without being obtrusive, at the end of the day anything can be done.

    It comes down to either how much you want to spend to get it done, and how much hassle you want to go to trying to achieve an acceptable result.
    I have done it on one house in the past, it was a painful process to do, yes it did look good, was it worth it, lets say I am not in a hurry to do it again.
    Great answer
    GREAT PLASTERING TIPS AT


  10. #10
    Community Moderator phild01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fuzzboy View Post

    (BTW this post has gone through before a longer explanatory post pending mod approval)
    done

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