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Used AGM Batteries

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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuppa View Post
    The inverter has the capability of pulling 460+ Amps from the batteries for a surge load & over 230 Amps continuous so needs a heavier cable, in fact i think it would need to be significantly thicker than your solar supply cables.

    Recyclers will often take dead batteries.
    Battery cable is 10mm diameter, cable only measurement without shield. (2/0 awg?)

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Window575 View Post
    Ok, will fix that too, sorry thought was only from controller to batteries.
    If you do add more solar don't just parallel with the others at the panels bring the cables to the controller and parallel it there. As for the old batteries the scrappies may give you a few shillings.

    Last I heard the batteries are shipped to China who do the dirty work.

  3. #103
    4K Club Member ringtail's Avatar
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    My battery acid fully neutralised. It took about 1.5 kg of bicarb. Now I'm left with a 4lt container with about 2 lt of acid/water mix at full strength and a 20 lt container with about 8 lt neutralised acid/water. Both shall go to the dump on their special hazardous waste days.

    Agree with a cable size increase for the OP too.

    So back to batteries. The exploder was the cranker out of my pajero. I ran a circuit breaker and (little 6 mm) wires to the rear of the paj to a second battery. Crude as. I suspect the cranker was being overcharged and was damaged hence the kaboom. Which leads me to the question. With a VSR, what stops the cranker being overcharged if one is running say, a lead acid cranker and an AGM aux ? I regularly saw over 15 v on the paj's volt meter but it is really primitive. Multi meter said high very 14's which I thought was fine as both cranker and aux were calcium/calcium.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringtail View Post
    So back to batteries. The exploder was the cranker out of my pajero. I ran a circuit breaker and (little 6 mm) wires to the rear of the paj to a second battery. Crude as. I suspect the cranker was being overcharged and was damaged hence the kaboom. Which leads me to the question. With a VSR, what stops the cranker being overcharged if one is running say, a lead acid cranker and an AGM aux ? I regularly saw over 15 v on the paj's volt meter but it is really primitive. Multi meter said high very 14's which I thought was fine as both cranker and aux were calcium/calcium.
    Your question is a little confusing. AGM is a type of seperate used in a battery, and you mention cranker (SLI) and auxiliary (deep cycle?).

    The main problem would be if the vehicle battery (often referred to a SLI application) is a flooded battery whereas the auxiliary may have been a sealed-lead-acid (SLA commonly a VRLA).

    Flooded batteries can tolerate a higher charging voltage as they are usually intended to gas (and therefore require topping up with water). SLA/VRLA (maintenance-free) are designed to contain the water and not vent - and therefore require a more strict control and limiting of the charging voltage.

    You can get away with charging a flooded battery using a VRLA charger but you shouldn't use a flooded battery charger on a VRLA!
    There is no middle ground between facts and fallacies - argumentum ad temperantiam

  5. #105
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    I'll check it out tomorrow as I will set my Scanguage on Volts and see the reading.

    All vehicles with very few exceptions parallel AGM aux batteries with flooded cranking.

  6. #106
    4K Club Member ringtail's Avatar
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    A calcium battery is still a flooded battery but has calcium paste on the plates. They require the highest voltage of all batteries to attain full charge, typically 14.5-14.9 V. As Bros said in nearly all cases there are different batteries used for crank and aux. Whether the difference is the type of construction (flooded, gel, agm etc...) or the application (crank, deep cycle, semi cycle etc...) there is nearly always a difference. This is why dcdc chargers have exploded in popularity. The myth or otherwise that surrounds charging two different types of batteries has increased their sales enormously.

    Another possible alternative for charging aux batteries is to hard wire an inverter to the cranker and run a 240v smart charger from the inverter purely to charge the aux battery/s. Going from dc to ac then back to dc always seems a bit counter productive to me but I think the concept has merit.

    Maybe ( and I can't believe I'm saying it) this thread needs splitting into "Aux battery set up"

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringtail View Post

    Another possible alternative for charging aux batteries is to hard wire an inverter to the cranker and run a 240v smart charger from the inverter purely to charge the aux battery/s. Going from dc to ac then back to dc always seems a bit counter productive to me but I think the concept has merit.
    I had that set-up already. On a trip the charger karked it and replaced the lot with a ctek.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringtail View Post
    A calcium battery is still a flooded battery but has calcium paste on the plates. They require the highest voltage of all batteries to attain full charge, typically 14.5-14.9 V. As Bros said in nearly all cases there are different batteries used for crank and aux. Whether the difference is the type of construction (flooded, gel, agm etc...) or the application (crank, deep cycle, semi cycle etc...) there is nearly always a difference. This is why dcdc chargers have exploded in popularity. The myth or otherwise that surrounds charging two different types of batteries has increased their sales enormously.

    Another possible alternative for charging aux batteries is to hard wire an inverter to the cranker and run a 240v smart charger from the inverter purely to charge the aux battery/s. Going from dc to ac then back to dc always seems a bit counter productive to me but I think the concept has merit.

    Maybe ( and I can't believe I'm saying it) this thread needs splitting into "Aux battery set up"
    There are definitely differences in the chargers for sealed and flooded batteries. Sealed batteries do need to be charged with an appropriate charger or there is a risk of gassing and the possibility of an explosion.

    Just because sealed and flooded are seemingly commonly connected in parallel as an auxiliary battery, it might not actually be the case. Many modern cars used sealed batteries and the charging system will suit a sealed auxiliary battery. Some cars have quite low voltage regulators in their alternator (mainly due to the temperature sensor for the voltage compensation being in the hot alternator instead of on the battery!).

    The calcium in the battery makes no practical difference to the (top-of-charge) charging voltage with respect to gassing. Check with the manufacturer if you have doubts - http://www.centurybatteries.com.au/c...y-charging.pdf The calcium does make the battery more prone to acid stratification if they are deeply discharged so they can benefit from some gassing to remix the acid from time to time, but this needs to be done in a controlled manner and limited in duration as gassing is still gassing - with all the risks associated with charging a sealed battery to gassing potential.

    The better way to charge the auxiliary battery in a vehicle (especially if it is a sealed type) would be to use a charger designed to be powered from a vehicle 12V system - such as Ridge Ryder 12v Battery Charger - DC-DC In Vehicle, 20 Amp - Supercheap Auto

    I am somewhat perplexed by your cavalier attitude ("myth or otherwise that surrounds charging two different types of batteries") considering that you recently experienced what happens when a sealed battery gasses and explodes. Anyway, you can decide for yourself how you want to mix and connect your batteries and what risks you are prepared to (unwittingly) take, but I will try and correct the misinformation when I see it.
    There is no middle ground between facts and fallacies - argumentum ad temperantiam

  9. #109
    4K Club Member ringtail's Avatar
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    WTF ? Cavalier attitude ? Where did that come from ? I suggest you read post 105 then read 106 again. Cavalier attitude, pfffft.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bros View Post
    I'll check it out tomorrow as I will set my Scanguage on Volts and see the reading.

    All vehicles with very few exceptions parallel AGM aux batteries with flooded cranking.
    As promised 14.1 for the half hour duration.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Window575 View Post
    What is the best way to dispose of the swollen batteries?
    Scrap metal place may give you a few $ for them or at least take them off your hands at no cost to you.

    Battery shops will often take them at no cost (they then sell them for scrap metal).

    Not sure if this is the case in all areas but around here you can simply drop old batteries off for recycling at the tip. Council keeps the $ from the scrap metal, they don't pay you for it, but I'm fine with that since it's a free (to me) service as such to just drop things off for recycling and it's obviously better than having them end up in landfill.

  12. #112
    4K Club Member ringtail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bros View Post
    As promised 14.1 for the half hour duration.
    Yep, no surprises there.

  13. #113
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    I think highjacked is a word I can safely use at this point. But thanks y'all for your help.

  14. #114
    4K Club Member ringtail's Avatar
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    Just killing time until you post

  15. #115
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    Getting onto upgrades of this shortly. Have just got 2x 32a two pole dc breakers (non polarised- Noark).
    I plan on putting one between the the panels and charge controller, and one between the charge controller and the battery bank. The only labelling on the breaker is 1,3 (at the top), 2,4 (at the bottom).
    Could I get verification on the correct way to wire for both installs?

    Thanks.img_8538.jpg

  16. #116
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    Asking again guys, can you help me out?
    It may be a very basic questions I'm asking, but I can't find any info on the wiring symbols that are on the breakers I have.
    I assume "in at the top and out at the bottom" but I'm done with assumptions. Especially with 2 pole stuff.
    Is this the way to go?
    +(in) on pole 1, and - (in) on pole 3.
    + (out) on pole 2, and - (out) on pole 4.

    You have all gone quiet on my time of need!

    thanks

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Window575 View Post
    Asking again guys, can you help me out?
    It may be a very basic questions I'm asking, but I can't find any info on the wiring symbols that are on the breakers I have.
    I assume "in at the top and out at the bottom" but I'm done with assumptions. Especially with 2 pole stuff.
    Is this the way to go?
    +(in) on pole 1, and - (in) on pole 3.
    + (out) on pole 2, and - (out) on pole 4.

    You have all gone quiet on my time of need!

    thanks
    you've got it. The answer was actually in your photo - the diagram on the right hand breaker.

    Usually the 'in' is on the bottom and the 'out' is on the top but it doesn't matter.
    There is no middle ground between facts and fallacies - argumentum ad temperantiam

  18. #118
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    Thanks Crisp. I did see the diagram but had no idea on how to read it!

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